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Messages - Francis Buck

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196
The Unholy Consult / Re: Zaudunyanicon Q&A
« on: August 13, 2017, 07:21:56 pm »
Not sure if I'm too late, but should anyone get the chance I am curious if RSB might shed some light on the suite of characters from the opening of TDTCB, particularly the Bard with one blind eye. For example, is there anything we might glean from real world mythology in regards to the nature of that character in particular, or are is that part of the narrative/timeline going to be more or less left alone from here on out?

197
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]What was the point
« on: August 13, 2017, 06:36:23 pm »
Regarding the Nail of Heaven, I have inclinations of varying degrees that it is analogous to historical cosmological notions of the "Central Fire", in addition to being (at the very least) a reference to the Secret Fire of Tolkien' Legendarium.

I have better links describing this idea tucked away somewhere, but one can gloss over Hermeticism in general to find some(?) of the ideas I'm referring to: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeticism

198
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Sorcerous Ekkinu
« on: August 09, 2017, 08:34:15 pm »
I have stumbled across something that may enlighten (or at least embellish) the great Ekinnu mystery. I'm pretty sure (well I'm damn near positive) that the Eleven Pole Chamber/Umbilicus/Ekinnu -- the whole royal tent thing -- is at least somewhat derived from the Tabernacle (as in the Biblical one).

From wiki:

Quote
"The Tabernacle according to the Hebrew Bible, was the portable earthly dwelling place of God amongst the children of Israel from the time of the Exodus from Egypt through the conquering of the land of Canaan."

Quote
"It describes an inner shrine, the Holy of Holies, which housed the Ark of the Covenant, which in turn was under the veil of the covering suspended by four pillars and an outer chamber (the "Holy Place"), containing beaten gold made into what is generally described as a lamp-stand or candlestick featuring a central shaft incorporating four almond-shaped bowls and six branches, each holding three bowls shaped like almonds and blossoms, 22 in all. It was standing diagonally, partially covering a table for showbread and with its seven oil lamps over against it to give light along with the altar of incense."



Quote
"Exodus 33:7-10 refers to "the Tabernacle of the congregation", which was set up outside of camp with the "cloudy pillar" visible at its door. The people directed their worship toward this center."


Note that the Veil hides the Ark of the Covenant. In TUC the Ekkinu is set before the Ark of the Consult...

(thank Madness for motivating my lazy ass to post this ;))

199
The Unholy Consult / Re: TUC - Moments that cut to the visceral quick
« on: August 08, 2017, 05:40:32 pm »
Almost all of the Moe. Jr stuff with Cnaiur, especially near the end with the first person bits. I also really got caught by the scene where Cnaiur goes up to Proyas and is literally punching the joists screaming "He! Is! Dunyain!". Like, for real, Cnaiur's the only one who REALLY got the Dunyain...aside from his girl-skinned son, that is.

Was just saying to Madness that Proyas's rallying speech was incredibly badass, very raw and human, enough to give me chills...until Kellhus shows up. I'm not really a Pro-Kellhus/Anti-Kellhus  guy at this stage, but Bakker went out of his way to make Kellhus really ugly in TUC.

That being said, I enjoyed Ajokli-Kellhus if only because I so instantly despised the Mutilated. When the line (not verbatim) like this came up:


"You forget, Brothers. This...is my place."

...well, can't say I didn't get a good shot from that one.

200
The Unholy Consult / Re: The Collected Works of Emilidis
« on: August 08, 2017, 05:29:12 pm »
Some thoughts:

Emilidis was able to create sorcerous objects that were immune to Chorae because, as noted in the glossary, Emilidis was all about recreating "patterns in nature" or something along those lines. Spirals, octagons, etc. Of course, in Earwa, the patterns in nature aren't random coincidence, and indeed they have intrinsically metaphysical qualities. In other words, it's not sorcery at all really. If anything it's close to the Psukhe, in terms of its application/nature. In a world of meaning, you don't actually need sorcery (which disrupts the Onta) to create "magic", you just need to focus in on the right (or rather most potent) forms of this intrinsic meaning, which is basically intersubjective concepts that have meaning whether there are people around to give them meaning or not. For us, a hundred dollar bill only has value because everyone decided it does. In Earwa, that value exists regardless (not the best analogy but it's a start).

Not sure if it was mentioned, but Emilidis also made the octogonal "fire-scrying" rings, one of which is used by Kellhus.

201
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Inchoroi in future books
« on: July 18, 2017, 08:11:51 pm »
My biggest crackpot (which TUC did not shatter) is that:

1. Earwa's timeline is cyclical -- I definitely think this is true in a soft sense, but I've suspected for a while that it may quite literally be perfectly cyclical, meaning not just similar events but the SAME events occur over and over, for all eternity. The Apocalypse(s) simply mark "transition" periods.

2. That the Inchoroi are thus humans from the "future"...or the past, depending on how you look at it. Only now I would amend that the Fathers of the Inchoroi weren't just humans -- they were Dunyain.

3. If the above two things are true (which is a big "if"), then I believe ALL the races are simply derivatives of humanity, even Wracu. Furthermore, certain characters (such as Aurang and Aurax, or the dragons) may actually be characters we know of from the series already...which has all kinds of crazy connotations.

I actually have a bunch of reasons supporting this, but it's still a shot in the dark(ness that comes before). I intend to explore it and other high-level metaphysical stuff in the series in a post I've been working on for quite a while, but was waiting for TUC's release -- along with enough free time to actually make a coherent post out of all my notes.

202
It is a western. A dark one doesn't come close to describe it. Ink-black, primal-primordial, existential-poetic; perhaps.

It's a tough one. You could consider starting with McCarthy's All the Pretty Horses. Less bleak and stark. Albeit, not a walk in the park either.

His style is unique and worthwhile exploring.

You could probably start with No Country for Old Men too, if you really wanted.

But I guess I should have pointed out the genre difference though.

I honestly consider Blood Meridian to be right up there with Lord of the Rings and Dune as essential reading for anyone with scholarly ambitions regarding TSA, particularly if one's interest is in the stylistic prose and philosophical aspects of the series (not to mention the sequences of war depicted in all its mind-shattering terror and bleakness).

Simply reading analyses of it afterward is almost guaranteed to open up new perspectives on TSA, even regarding how the metaphysics (might) work, a considerable amount of which would be pretty hard to catch on unless someone happens to be familiar with esoteric Gnostic myth and theology.

No Country For Old Men has less (and less obvious) elements of influence, but it's also perhaps my favorite standalone book of all time and is a very good introduction to McCarthy's style. It's nowhere near as dense or challenging as Blood Meridian and is actually a relatively "light read" (in terms of accessibility -- it's still bleak as all hell). 

203
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
« on: July 15, 2017, 03:30:48 am »
I think the main point to take away from the Sranc ---> Inchoroi comparison is that, in reality, EVERYTHING is just "another variety of Sranc". I don't remember the exact line but the text more or less states this outright. Men themselves are a "weapon race" just as any other, driven by their own particular set of desires (and basically all the races -- Sranc, Nonmen, Inchoroi, even Gods and Dunyain -- are subject to this).

The Dunyain's vast intellect makes them no less subject to the Darkness that comes before, as illustrated by the Apocalypse of Koringhus. The Dunyain "feed" on knowledge and the domination of circumstances just as Sranc "feed" on violent congress, etc. The Mutilated see the Ark as a genuine religious object (even if they do not think of it as such). They see the Absolute as a prize, or something to be achieved, when in fact it is yet one more carrot on a stick.

204
General Misc. / Re: Thread for the Threadless (Surrogate Quorum)
« on: July 13, 2017, 04:11:45 pm »
VFX artists have been rolling their eyes in reaction to Serkis's comments in the past.

Important factoid is that this also reflects the awful working conditions in that field.

Besides, I *am* looking forward to War for the Planet of the Apes.

Really want to catch this in theaters. First two were glorious.

I still remember being in a packed cinema for the first one (I've lost track of their unfortunately hyper-generic titles) and being amazed when Caesar first yelled "No!" at Draco Malfoy. The entire theater went dead silent/gasped, and you could actually feel the audience's energy change from there on into the finale.

205
So, anyway we slice it, right now Kellhus is a God/Ciphrang on the Outside, right? His soul had to go somewhere and he died before the resurrection of the No-God. So, maybe all is not lost for Kellhus.
No. It's a reasonable guess , but my take was that ajokli harvested kellhus.


What brought you to that conclusion? I felt when Kel appears that Ajokli left Kellhus and Kellhus got salted. Then his soul would go onto the Outside, where I believe he'd be as powerful as any or most entities.

Wishful thinking. ;)

Real talk: I still have to mull over a lot of stuff here and do my own full unpacking of my thoughts, but regarding this specific issue, my inclination (and it's just an inclination) now is that Kellhus is still the one pulling the strings. My interpretation of Kellhus as a character is that of a trickster-hero, and that he's also a merging of traditional Western and Eastern mythological hero-cycle archetypes.

I also still have a long-held suspicion that "Samarmas" (or the voice we heard as Samarmas) is actually Kellhus -- meaning he actually is, in fact, the No-God. But at this point I really have no damn clue.

So, anyway we slice it, right now Kellhus is a God/Ciphrang on the Outside, right? His soul had to go somewhere and he died before the resurrection of the No-God. So, maybe all is not lost for Kellhus.
No. It's a reasonable guess , but my take was that ajokli harvested kellhus.


What brought you to that conclusion? I felt when Kel appears that Ajokli left Kellhus and Kellhus got salted. Then his soul would go onto the Outside, where I believe he'd be as powerful as any or most entities.
Everything that Kelmomas ever said about Ajokli (particularly chapter six of TGO). Ajokli's nature is to raise people up, and then betray (harvest) them at the point of their maximal achievement, thus he turns their victories into defeats (and feasts upon them). Why? Because he is Immortal Malice. The Great Deceiver. The Trickster. The Prince of Hate. And Kellhus is the tastiest, biggest fruit of all that has been ripening and maturing for decades. It's quite the harvest for the god, and he is only acting out his nature.

But do you discount the notion that Kellhus actually did make a pact with the Pit, as he said? Making a deal with the Devil for unfathomable -- but worldly -- power.


206
The Unholy Consult / [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
« on: July 10, 2017, 03:16:46 am »
Given the ambiguity of the ending, a surprisingly large number of the core cast may still be alive, in one form or another. On the other hand, virtually everyone could be dead. Since we are unlikely to get an answer to this whatsoever until the next book, I imagine there will be a lot of discussion on the possibilities.

In terms of who survived Golgotterath, I think there are some which are nearly guaranteed, at least as much as anything can be guaranteed in this series.

My own thoughts, after only a cursory re-reading of select scenes, is listed roughly from most to least likely:

(click to show/hide)


   

207
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Glimir vs Alamir
« on: July 10, 2017, 02:31:31 am »
Shauriatas became shauriatis in TUC


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah this was especially weird to me. Had me wondering if it was on purpose for some reason lol, but I hadn't noticed any of the others people mentioned here in my first re-read.

208
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Thousandfold Thought
« on: July 09, 2017, 08:31:37 pm »
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209
General Misc. / Re: Thread for the Threadless (Surrogate Quorum)
« on: July 09, 2017, 06:58:45 am »
Yes...This is my place.

210
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Thousandfold Thought
« on: July 09, 2017, 06:47:19 am »
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