The Second Apocalypse

Earwa => General Earwa => Topic started by: Davias on January 08, 2014, 07:55:41 pm

Title: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Davias on January 08, 2014, 07:55:41 pm
When was the last time in your real life, you have talked about Bakker, his books, especially the Second Apocalypse?

Here is a little tale from my last weekend:

Four guys, two women, sitting in a brewery pub.

One of the guys likes to talk about literature, strange movies, philosophical problems and the way of life. I must say, his intellect is mostly superior to mine, and he is a little bit of an asshole ( maybe it is my opinion only, because he IS clearly more intelligent than I  ;D  aaahh, mankind are ever deceived... 8) ). But I like him, sometimes, because he has some cool and interesting ideas and thoughts about many things.

Anyway, we two talked about the meaning of extrinsic and intrinsic motivation and how our own actions in the daily life are influenced by either one of the two.
This conversation clearly was the reason, the three other guys and the two women began to complain about us. They wanted a nice, little evening with alot of alcohol and slight talk about their last relationships and some talk about movies, books and mainstream movies.
Ok, when my dialog partner drank his eighth or ninths beer , I finally surrendered to the alienate stares of the two women and switched to their current discussion. About books.
I wasn't too drunk at that moment, but five beers, and flashing thoughts about my love for the Second Apocalypse were enough to threw the shit against the wall.
One of the girls talked about the silly Shades of Grey books. I wasn't to impressed by her statements about it.
She was a little bit pissed by my following comments and asked:"And what literature is YOUR cup of tea?"

"Oh, mostly fantasy and history books."

She had a little twinkle in her eyes. Clearly a touch of triumph. "Oh, Fantasy? Like the Lord of the Rings, or that Hobbit nonsense?"

"In some way...yes. But more about aliens and creatures who would fuck your skull, when it was seperated from your body or raping children and innocents."

Short silence. Frowning. Irritation. A short attempt to say something significant, which I interrupted.
"Oh, that's only the bad guys. There are some good guys too. One is a barbarian, who kills men and children alike and rapes women, clearly one of my favourite characters. The other some sort of monk, who feels no love, who uses and controls other men for his own reasons. Ahh, and a slightly depressed sorceror and a ingrained whore."

More Silence, then:"What? What is this pervert shit you are talking about? Who wants to read about THAT?"

"Oh it is very interesting, you should read it. There is also philosphy in it and some new and fresh ideas. It is EPIC!"

"I didn't want to read fantasy. Most certainly not this shit about rape and aliens. But it seems, some men like to read about killing, rape and about denigrate women."

"But you liked the ridiculous Shades of Grey? Oh, here is a realistic tale about strong and thoughtful women..."

"It isn't about rape. It is about a strange and difficult relationship and the dreams and erotic fantasies of a young and initially naive woman. But you know nothing about women, it seems."

I grabbed my beer and drank it with one gulp. Then ordering another. "Ok, you think so. Then we shoud talk about another topic."

The following topic was about movies. Not a good idea.... :D
Maybe I should accept my fate and continue my search for a woman, strong enough to bear my seed.  :P

Ok, the text is too long and the story a little bit insignificant episode in a whole, but that evening was the last time I talked about Bakker in the public. Maybe I didn't really point to the STRONG works in Bakker's books  ;D but my inner prick demanded it







Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 09, 2014, 12:44:23 pm
Hmm...

Usually, Bakker gets mentioned in the context of this forum - which I'm obviously on far too much - or in my borrowing arguments from Bakker's books (which, I guarantee gave me a metaphorical advantage as I've pursured my philosophy degree) and usually begin "well, my favorite author..." ;).

But your story was much better.

I would love, LOVE, Bakker to write some version of Fifty Shades of Grey. I feel like every woman I knew who could read (which was more then I thought to begin with - literacy is down for all gendered identifications ;)), read those books...
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Duskweaver on January 09, 2014, 09:35:12 pm
Heh. My 66-year-old (and pretty hardcore feminist) mother turned out to enjoy The Second Apocalypse books even more than I did. So I'm thinking the problem is one of presentation more than Bakker's work genuinely being, umm... too spicy for Cthuulhu. ;)

When I wax evangelical about Bakker's writing, I tend to talk about his fascinating and (AFAIK) unique take on the metaphysics of sorcery and gods, as well as his Blind Brain ideas, rather than the rape-alien stuff. But maybe that's because I genuinely want to share the awesome experience of reading Bakker, rather than trying to make myself look all cool and edgy.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Callan S. on January 10, 2014, 07:12:06 am
Man, that sales pitch did not go well!

Though it is funny how either they are dismissive, because it's all happy go lucky hobbits and thus ignorable for being lightweight, or it's rape and ignoreable for being heavyweight.

I think you have to have a little respect for your own position - if she just uses fantasy as a social scoring point ("oh, you like silly things! Me more important in playground than u!"), it's not going to work out between you terribly well, is it?

I think the funny thing to have said is "Ah, so if the naive young woman had been a hobbit, then fifty shades would have been silly? Or does the alegorical race involved not matter? Unless of course the reader can't understand a metaphor to save their lives!"


Heh. My 66-year-old (and pretty hardcore feminist) mother turned out to enjoy The Second Apocalypse books even more than I did.
UH! Now you have to talk with her about the book and post about it here as best you can remember the conversation! No buts! :)
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Royce on January 10, 2014, 07:27:14 am
Quote
When I wax evangelical about Bakker's writing, I tend to talk about his fascinating and (AFAIK) unique take on the metaphysics of sorcery and gods, as well as his Blind Brain ideas, rather than the rape-alien stuff. But maybe that's because I genuinely want to share the awesome experience of reading Bakker, rather than trying to make myself look all cool and edgy.

You sound cool and edgy by saying that :)
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 10, 2014, 12:54:30 pm
It's 'cause irony is cool and edgy, Royce ;).

I'm with Callan, Duskweaver. If she can't join the forum, then I suggest we do the inaugural SA Podcast and interview her together.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Royce on January 10, 2014, 03:05:29 pm
Oh, but irony is so difficult to detect  when you do not know the person, and you can not read his body language when he is speaking:)

An SA podcast sounds awesome by the way :)
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 10, 2014, 07:51:59 pm
I'd love to figure out how to make it possible, Royce. Maybe a half hour conversation every month or something?

There are plenty of talented people here at SA, who are worth more than just their nerdanels on TSA ;). It'd be interesting to get to know some of the fans, learn from each other.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Davias on January 10, 2014, 08:18:46 pm
+1 Callan S.
Quote
"Ah, so if the naive young woman had been a hobbit, then fifty shades would have been silly? Or does the alegorical race involved not matter? Unless of course the reader can't understand a metaphor to save their lives!"

Why I didn't think of that answer at the pub? That would have been a cool way to dominate the circumstances like a real Dunyain. :D

The next time I must capture a whole conversation about the second apocalypse in public on a dictaphone, to analyse it on the next day.
I have a friend, who loves to discuss complicated shit with me and although he doesn't like fantasy very much, he will listen curiously to my explanation of Bakker's books. And he has a cool, big whiteboard in his workroom. There could be some Enlightenment for me.

( By the way, That evening in the brewery pub didn't went well for me after that, healthwise. I ended up with the intelligent, drunken guy a few hours and a few whiskys later at a kitchen table, terrible drunk, loosing a few rounds of poker and discussing some shit about particel physics with him. To demonstrate an example, he drenched some cards with alcohol and tore some cards in many tiny bits of paper ::) .
My friend, the owner of the cards, wasn't too amused, but he knew the guy quite well and has accepted his strange behaviour a long time ago. All in all, it was a funny night. But when I opened my eyes, on the next day, my head burst in a thousand pieces... :-\ )
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Callan S. on January 10, 2014, 11:10:48 pm
you were the card...
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Royce on January 11, 2014, 08:57:58 am
Quote
I'd love to figure out how to make it possible, Royce. Maybe a half hour conversation every month or something?

There are plenty of talented people here at SA, who are worth more than just their nerdanels on TSA ;). It'd be interesting to get to know some of the fans, learn from each other.

Yes, that would be interesting indeed. Personally I enjoy immensely discussing on this forum, hence my name pops up
almost every day:)

Plenty of talented people here yes, and what I appreciate the most is that my own perspectives are challenged a lot, so
I learn a lot about how to handle that, and to spin around these new perspectives that people bring forth.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 11, 2014, 03:24:00 pm
is that my own perspectives are challenged a lot, so
I learn a lot about how to handle that

+1.

And he has a cool, big whiteboard in his workroom.

Whiteboard, Chalkboard, Smartboard, etc, are all awesome.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Srancy on January 13, 2014, 12:31:06 am
I mostly walk door-to-door asking if they have been saved by Kellhus
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Callan S. on January 13, 2014, 04:41:46 am
Slaved? Oh, no, I just read too quickly...
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Francis Buck on January 16, 2014, 04:01:55 am
I would love to participate in a podcast. I'm down 100%. We could also not have it solely be about TSA, but with some flavouring regarding philosophy, science, fantasy genre in general, etc. (of course most of those topics would likely just come up naturally in a TSA conversation regardless).
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 16, 2014, 03:26:50 pm
Let's do it, FB. I think we should limit it to one or two participants a session (so maybe one more now, as I'm down to do this anytime), one session a month or bi-weekly (insofar as I can be involved anyhow - I don't always have to play "host").

Also, I'd say we get some constrained suggestions (I have a couple thoughts in mind) to serve as bullet-points for topics? It allows a level of focus to flesh-out specifics (while allowing for a range of topics outside TSA as FB suggested) and allow for many, many podcasts before wearing through content ;).
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Wilshire on January 16, 2014, 03:39:49 pm
A TSA podcast makes me think of 2-3 guys in suits sitting in armchairs by a fireplace sipping cognac and smoking pipes and/or cigars. I wouldn't smoke in a suit, and I don't have a fireplace or really even an armchair, but I might consider participating. Though first I need to get a mic that doesn't sound like I'm talking through a tin can, it echos like mad.

You should setup a Skype date so participants can get-to-know each other before you start recording shit... Or teamspeak if you are nerdy enough to have one *cough*. lmao a TSA teamspeak channel would be hilarious (and probably just empty all the time but whatever, the idea is there). Madness this server space you're renting, is it specifically for this site or can you host a myriad of programs as long as your under some max bandwidth threshold?
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 16, 2014, 03:54:13 pm
Lol.

There may or may not be pipes and/or cigars involved. I'll probably be in one of my adult onesies - I'm too poor to afford suits (though, everyone looks good in a suit (http://vimeo.com/37855064)).

I'd down for a pre-podcast Skype date - I'm sure this could just be factored into some time directly beforehand (if we're recording for an hour, arrange for an hour and a half). Skype (whether the session is video or just audio) was how I thought it should be done - and record/release the audio.

I'm not really sure, Wilshire. I'm thinking that I have some max bandwidth threshold as I'm allowed to load pretty much whatever I like and I'm in no way limited to a forum with the .com (I don't have the patience or the time to learn php or html (again) to make a fansite, though it's something I wanted to do) - I'm not sure I could host teamspeak?
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Francis Buck on January 17, 2014, 01:59:08 am
I'm in. I have to find my microphone (I'm almost certain I have one, just not sure where). Can you handle the "tech" side of things Madness? I've no experience with this stuff at all -- though I don't imagine it's especially hard. Would we just do the whole thing on Skype (I've never used Skype, but it's a free download correct)? Regardless, I agree we should do a "set-up" session to iron things out before the real one. I personally can't do video -- no webcam, though I might I'd consider getting a cheap one at some point (then again, I'd almost rather keep it just audio, since that's part of the fun of podcasts -- just being able to listen to them whenever, wherever).

I think we should have three people if possible. Occasionally maybe four, or two if we can't get someone else, but three is a good number I think. Enough viewpoints while still be able to have a good conversation and allow everyone speak. I think that one of the main topics in the first podcast should be a quick sort of how we came to the TSA series, what drew us to it, the influences, etc., and then later we could get into some speculation/debate (which is probably the meatier, more interesting stuff).

Where do you live Madness? Is there a difference in timezones? I'm in Pennsylvania, so EST.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Wilshire on January 17, 2014, 02:47:13 pm
Haha I feel like no matter what topic you pick you'll just be rehashing whatever was written down here on this forum.

And, not to be cruel, but who would watch it? I've never watched a podcast so maybe I don't have the best perspective.... I guess I'm saying whats the point?

Don't let me put a downer on the whole situation though, sounds like you'll have fun and I'd listen to the first one to see how it turns out.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 17, 2014, 06:16:30 pm
I'm in. I have to find my microphone (I'm almost certain I have one, just not sure where). Can you handle the "tech" side of things Madness? I've no experience with this stuff at all -- though I don't imagine it's especially hard. Would we just do the whole thing on Skype (I've never used Skype, but it's a free download correct)? Regardless, I agree we should do a "set-up" session to iron things out before the real one. I personally can't do video -- no webcam, though I might I'd consider getting a cheap one at some point (then again, I'd almost rather keep it just audio, since that's part of the fun of podcasts -- just being able to listen to them whenever, wherever).

Yeah, I'll handle recording and posting, etc. Wilshire is opposed to Skype due to connectivity flaws (though, regardless if participants could see each other, I always intended to release-audio only). I found a multi-platform chat-program called Mumble (I'm on a Mac) and Wilshire suggested TeamSpeak. Either could work.

I think we should have three people if possible. Occasionally maybe four, or two if we can't get someone else, but three is a good number I think. Enough viewpoints while still be able to have a good conversation and allow everyone speak. I think that one of the main topics in the first podcast should be a quick sort of how we came to the TSA series, what drew us to it, the influences, etc., and then later we could get into some speculation/debate (which is probably the meatier, more interesting stuff).

We'll do you, Wilshire, and I for the first time then. I agree three or four seems like a good size group.

Inaugural topics suggested:

- How we came to TSA
- What drew us?
- What influences did we follow?
- Etc?
- Speculation/Debate (It's my vote that for the TSA content we specifically pick a focused topic (or a handful) for each one - but the first one I think we should widen the scope to some possible TUC themes).

Where do you live Madness? Is there a difference in timezones? I'm in Pennsylvania, so EST.

I'm in the Great Canadian North but I'm still tucked in at the edge of EST.

Haha I feel like no matter what topic you pick you'll just be rehashing whatever was written down here on this forum.

Of course, we will. But that's why I think ultimately limiting our podcast topics to a couple specific threads will allow us to have many podcasts and go through that information slowly (as well as offering abundant segue opportunity for the interesting forumers).

And, not to be cruel, but who would watch it? I've never watched a podcast so maybe I don't have the best perspective.... I guess I'm saying whats the point?

The video only came up because I thought Skype might be the best option.

Don't let me put a downer on the whole situation though, sounds like you'll have fun and I'd listen to the first one to see how it turns out.

Umm... you're clearly involved as the third leg of the inaugural tripod :P.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Wilshire on January 17, 2014, 07:35:12 pm
Hey man I'm on the fence still. I've committed to nothing! Not sure if I'm ready for that kind of commitment. Dunno if I could take it seriously enough to be a participant. Then again, what if it goes over real well and Bakker throws a few participants into the acknowledgment section of TUC (don't think he has put in forum goes since PoN). Decisions decisions.

Heard good things about mumble as well.

And I say "watch(ed)", meaning of course "listen(ed) to", since I guess podcasts are usually audio (not that I'd know as I haven't partaken). 
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 17, 2014, 10:43:28 pm
Lol - I'm pretty sure few of us have had the opportunity to discuss this stuff with others of our ken. If you feel like getting involved Wilshire, it'll probably be a pretty fun time and I know fans of the books will enjoy it. Regardless of Bakker's input, it'll be a good attempt at stimulating the fan involvement with the series/newcomers.

If anything we won't be able to get the words out fast enough and 45 - 60 min is going to see like it flew by.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Alia on January 19, 2014, 12:43:32 pm
Coming back to the topic - I have terribly good memory. And I mean that - terribly good. I remember _everything_. Which is a problem. So recently in a conversation I mentioned Erratics, because I can really feel for them. My life of course has been much shorter, but I know this feeling quite well, when all those bad, unpleasant memories stack up and weigh you down.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 19, 2014, 03:16:25 pm
Is it something you've had checked out, Alia? I always enjoy reading the perspectives of anomalous memory - as much as they are states alien to mine own, as I remember little more comparably to the people around me.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Callan S. on January 19, 2014, 10:28:09 pm
Coming back to the topic - I have terribly good memory. And I mean that - terribly good. I remember _everything_. Which is a problem. So recently in a conversation I mentioned Erratics, because I can really feel for them. My life of course has been much shorter, but I know this feeling quite well, when all those bad, unpleasant memories stack up and weigh you down.
Alia, I hope you've read/think you should read Disciple of the Dog, given the depiction of a character with eidetic memory.

I'd probably also recommend applying a categorisation method, determining a category before entering a potentially memory filled situation (ie, leaving the front door) for what association the memory is to have in terms of category. Then you decide which category you think within, so to speak. So as to stop the stack up occuring, unless you choose to think in the category/folder they are attached to.

As a male I tend to offer potential solutions as a method of giving sympathy rather than just directly sympathising. Just saying in case this seems a dry responce - I do feel for your position.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Alia on January 20, 2014, 07:38:28 pm
Madness, no, I haven't had it checked or anything, it's just something I try to live with. And well, it has it's perks, too - at my job I'm the one everybody turns to if they want to find out when the next meeting is or compatible. Not to mention learning foreign languages, of course.
I haven't read Disciple of the Dog, maybe I should give it a try.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 20, 2014, 09:34:31 pm
Definitely try Disciple, Alia.

And, of course, let us know what you think, love it or hate it.

Madness, no, I haven't had it checked or anything, it's just something I try to live with. And well, it has it's perks, too - at my job I'm the one everybody turns to if they want to find out when the next meeting is or compatible. Not to mention learning foreign languages, of course.

Colour me curious.

Are you a polylinguist?

I'm not sure if you've personally researched it then but I'm interested in what you feel your constraints are.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Duskweaver on January 22, 2014, 09:05:59 am
I love how I can be away for a few days and the thread goes completely off the rails and gets rerouted into a station on a different continent altogether. ::) ;)

Quote from: Callan S.
UH! Now you have to talk with her about the book and post about it here as best you can remember the conversation! No buts! :)
If anyone has any specific questions you want me to ask her, I'm happy to pass them on. We have discussed the books previously, though, obviously.

One interesting (maybe?) thing is that she hated Neuropath, to the point that she didn't recognise that it was by the same author until I pointed it out. I think some ideas are easier to accept in a fantasy setting than in a 'real world' 'twenty minutes into the future' one. Or maybe it's her reflexive distrust of psychologists (apparently all the psychologists she's ever met have been creepy weirdos).

Another possibly interesting thing is her reaction to me telling her about certain internet feminists who accuse Bakker of being a misogynist. It was basically an incredulous "What?!", followed by her wondering whether Margaret Atwood would have been accused of being a misogynist if she'd published The Handmaid's Tale under a male pen-name. The point being that assuming an author approves of the social mores of a fictional world he or she has invented is really bloody stupid.

Quote from: Royce
You sound cool and edgy by saying that
Quote from: Madness
It's 'cause irony is cool and edgy, Royce
I'm glad you understood what I was going for there. I was worried it would come across as just passive-aggressive dickishness... ;)
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 22, 2014, 01:26:20 pm
I love how I can be away for a few days and the thread goes completely off the rails and gets rerouted into a station on a different continent altogether. ::) ;)

Since you were specifically part of the initial thoughts, do you think that you'd be down to consent at some point in the relative future to be a guest member on the podcast ;)?

Quote from: Callan S.
UH! Now you have to talk with her about the book and post about it here as best you can remember the conversation! No buts! :)
If anyone has any specific questions you want me to ask her, I'm happy to pass them on. We have discussed the books previously, though, obviously.

Hmm... I'd hope that others would use this opportunity. But for my paper, I'm hoping to use a number of themes for part of a feminist reflection of TSA (I've isolated a number I think I can argue with the evidence at hand but I'm sure she can learn me something).

So perhaps you could ask her (if she knows) what are some current in-use tropes by feminist-friendly writers (gendered whatever) and maybe some comparison literature she would recommend.

One interesting (maybe?) thing is that she hated Neuropath, to the point that she didn't recognise that it was by the same author until I pointed it out. I think some ideas are easier to accept in a fantasy setting than in a 'real world' 'twenty minutes into the future' one. Or maybe it's her reflexive distrust of psychologists (apparently all the psychologists she's ever met have been creepy weirdos).

Lol. Did she finish it?

Another possibly interesting thing is her reaction to me telling her about certain internet feminists who accuse Bakker of being a misogynist. It was basically an incredulous "What?!", followed by her wondering whether Margaret Atwood would have been accused of being a misogynist if she'd published The Handmaid's Tale under a male pen-name. The point being that assuming an author approves of the social mores of a fictional world he or she has invented is really bloody stupid.

+1 but specifically the bold. Though, Tiptree was a renowned "male" writer who was still renowned after Sheldon revealed herself.

Have you checked out the discussion in Disciple of the Dog, Just started this...posting my thoughts (and just general discussion) (http://second-apocalypse.com/index.php?topic=1124.0), which segued into this kind of content half-way around page one (obviously, open spoilers for Disciple

Quote from: Royce
You sound cool and edgy by saying that
Quote from: Madness
It's 'cause irony is cool and edgy, Royce
I'm glad you understood what I was going for there. I was worried it would come across as just passive-aggressive dickishness... ;)

Lol.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Alia on January 22, 2014, 02:54:57 pm
Are you a polylinguist?

I'm not sure if you've personally researched it then but I'm interested in what you feel your constraints are.

Well, English is not my native language but I've mastered to such an extent (at least in writing, my accent is far from perfect) that I can pass for a native speaker. I also speak German. When I was younger, I learnt Russian and French, but I never perfected them, mostly due to lack of time. But I can steal read Russian and roughly understand what it's all about. And I'm thinking of learning something else altogether, maybe Spanish, maybe Swedish... well, I might do that when I retire.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 22, 2014, 07:07:07 pm
That is very cool :).
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Duskweaver on January 23, 2014, 10:21:45 am
Since you were specifically part of the initial thoughts, do you think that you'd be down to consent at some point in the relative future to be a guest member on the podcast ;)?
Sure. It will be audio-only, though, and timing is dependant on my work schedule. Some time in July/August would probably be best.

Quote
So perhaps you could ask her (if she knows) what are some current in-use tropes by feminist-friendly writers (gendered whatever) and maybe some comparison literature she would recommend.
I'll ask. I gather she's not generally too impressed with the current crop of 'deliberately feminist' writers, though. I do know Robin Hobb/Megan Lindholm is her favourite fantasy and sci-fi author, for whatever that's worth.

Quote
Lol. Did she finish it?
Oh yes. I don't recall her ever not finishing a book once she's started, even if she hates it.

Quote
Have you checked out the discussion in Disciple of the Dog
I haven't, and I won't until I've actually read the book.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 23, 2014, 01:36:08 pm
Sure. It will be audio-only, though, and timing is dependant on my work schedule. Some time in July/August would probably be best.

That's awesome.

I'm not sure how closely you read the intervening conversation but audio-only was always the plan for release. On the recording itself it's actually unnecessary to use real identification beyond our membership here (as we're finding a program like TeamSpeak, if you are familiar with gaming chat servers). Though, I very much like FB's idea of making it about the members and the books, as Bakker fandom is individually both interesting and knowledgeable.

And absolutely, it's about guest comfort, whenever, however, is fine :).

I do know Robin Hobb/Megan Lindholm is her favourite fantasy and sci-fi author, for whatever that's worth.

Sweet.

Oh yes. I don't recall her ever not finishing a book once she's started, even if she hates it.

A dedicated person.

Quote
Have you checked out the discussion in Disciple of the Dog
I haven't, and I won't until I've actually read the book.

That is a shame. You want a copy of Disciple sent to you?
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Callan S. on January 23, 2014, 07:02:40 pm
If anyone has any specific questions you want me to ask her, I'm happy to pass them on. We have discussed the books previously, though, obviously.
I'll go with a corny, yet still important one: Who was her favorite character? :)
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Wilshire on January 23, 2014, 07:19:28 pm
I feel that everyone who read the books and enjoyed them should make a username and have a presence here... but that's just me.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Duskweaver on January 23, 2014, 10:00:03 pm
That is a shame. You want a copy of Disciple sent to you?
Thanks, but I didn't say I didn't own a copy, just that I haven't read it yet. I have a waist-high stack of books next to my bed to wade through, and Disciple is in there somewhere. I just need to find some way of increasing the number of hours in the day beyond the sadly inadequate twenty-four, so that I have more time to read. Or maybe I should just give up on sleep altogether... :-\ :P

I'll go with a corny, yet still important one: Who was her favorite character? :)
I'll ask. If we're lucky, she might actually be able to remember the character's name. I assume you'll want me to ask why as well?

I feel that everyone who read the books and enjoyed them should make a username and have a presence here... but that's just me.
Just how small do you think Bakker's readership is? :o
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Wilshire on January 23, 2014, 10:32:21 pm

I feel that everyone who read the books and enjoyed them should make a username and have a presence here... but that's just me.
Just how small do you think Bakker's readership is? :o

Well how many books has he sold? 500k?
5 books so far, 100k each.

So at max around 100k people. But I think many people bought multiple copies and distribute them... So more like 80k, But those are just people who bought books, not people who might have liked the books.

So cut that in half, and you get a nice round 40k fans, total, worldwide.

Perhaps the server can't handle that many :P but it would be nice to get them all here.

edit:
which makes a Bakker fan about 1 in million (ok more like 6 in a million )
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 24, 2014, 12:45:40 pm
That is a shame. You want a copy of Disciple sent to you?
Thanks, but I didn't say I didn't own a copy, just that I haven't read it yet. I have a waist-high stack of books next to my bed to wade through, and Disciple is in there somewhere. I just need to find some way of increasing the number of hours in the day beyond the sadly inadequate twenty-four, so that I have more time to read. Or maybe I should just give up on sleep altogether... :-\ :P

It'll take you all of two hours to read, fool (assuming you are also an avid reader).

I've found that forgoing a social life altogether can work wonders ;). But don't miss sleep. Way too important.
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Callan S. on January 25, 2014, 12:11:51 am
I can't read that fast!

Besides, surely you want to chew each mouthful 42 times? If only to pad out the wait between books!

Just joking around :)
Title: Re: Last time you mentioned Bakker or the Second Apocalypse?
Post by: Madness on January 25, 2014, 02:07:36 pm
Lol - well, the Japanese say thirty bites...

Two hours was in jest (I actually try and stop myself from speed-reading as much as what I do isn't actually that moreso than just a lifelong habit). But surely Duskweaver could read Disciple in a short afternoon - though, I actually also work stop myself from reading in one sitting on the first time...