Chanv and qirri.

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« on: May 29, 2013, 04:57:24 pm »
Quote from: Curethan
Seem similar to me. 
Perhaps chanv comes from sranc (remember they are geneticly twisted non-men).
Given that chanv deadens the emotions whilst sharpening the intellect, it could be part of Kellhus' plan to get the ordeal more 'emotionally prepared' prior to direct conflict with the consult.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2014, 07:56:40 pm by Wilshire »

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« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2013, 04:57:34 pm »
Quote from: BargiltheDestroyer
Its mentioned in the books that the only reason Eleazaras doesn't partake of chanv is the fact that nobody knows where it comes from.  Also, correct me if I am wrong but isnt Iyokus described as having translucent skin.  I seem to remember parts where Eleazaras or someone can see Iyokus's veins and muscles through his skin.  I believe the Inchoroi also have translucent skin.

Stupid theory:  Chanv is another, centuries long method by which the Consult attempts to dominate civilizations of Men.  Skin spies in key positions of power exist throughout the pre-Kelhus Three Seas, but chanv seems exclusive to the Ainoni nobility, perhaps the Consult's reaction to one of the great powers being under the direct rule of a  School.

A couple problems I see with this is that we know Non-men ashes have effects similar to chanv like increased mental prowess, neutered emotions, and night vision for some reason.  I dont remember anything about Iyokus having superior night vision, nor the Skin Eaters having see through skin.

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« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2013, 04:57:44 pm »
Quote from: Curethan
I seem to remember that chanv comes via Zeum.

I had forgotten about the skin translucency etc, but I think that could tie into my theory, in as much as the non-man dna could be mixed with that of the inchies within the sranc by means of the Tekne.

Certainly agree that the consult could be responsible for chanv in the manner you suggest. 

crackpot: If Kellhus intends to serve/ally with the no-god (not neccesarily to the consult's benefit), ingesting sranc might cause the men of the ordeal to be susceptible to the no-god's will-binding powers.  Or perhaps it might flow the other way, causing Mog to be able to apprehend himself through other's perceptions :p

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« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2013, 04:57:51 pm »
Quote from: sciborg2
From the wiki:

Quote
Jekhia is a tributart nation of High Ainon, located at the headwaters of the River Sayut in the Great Kayarsus.

Jekhia is famed as the mysterious source of chanv.

The Men of Jekhia are unique in that they exhibit Xiuhianni racial characteristics.

Iyokus does become translucent. It's why Eli trusts him even after realizing there are skin spies everywhere.

I'm not sure if eating Sranc will be enough to place them under the No-God's control. I think the No-God enters into beings that lack souls. Which is why it can command all dragons save Wutteat, who being the precursor has a soul.

(I think Wutteat was altered from existing life, rather than made whole cloth from the Tekne.)

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« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:00 pm »
Quote from: Curethan
Agree with you there, put that controlling theory to bed. 
And Jekhia is near the Katyursus mountains and nowhere near the north, so unless the mountains are full of sranc, chanv is probably unlikely to be made from them.

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« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:07 pm »
Quote from: lockesnow
what does xiuhianni racial characteristics mean?

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« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:15 pm »
Quote from: Madness
Quote from: p.501, TTT Glossary
Xiuhianni: The Xiuhianni are one of the Five Tribes of Men. They are a black-haired, brown-eyed, olive-skinned race that still dwells beyond the Great Kayarsus.

According to The Chronicle of the Tusk, the Xiuhianni refused to follow the other four tribes into Eärwa.

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« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:25 pm »
Quote from: Octavian
Random question, wasn't the tracker that was with the Skin-Spies (I forget his name) Jekhian?

 I always found it curious how Akka, being as learned as he is did not pick up on the similarities between Chanv and Quiri. Being that it turns the skin see through, I wonder if it is Inchoroi remains or something that they introduced or developed.

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« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:32 pm »
Quote from: Bastard of Godsgrace
Yeah, considering its origins chanv is unlikely to have anything in common with Sranc or qirri. Since it is associated with Xiuhanni, it most likely comes from Eanna. It also clearly Bakkerworld equivalent of spice and I wonder how this will play out. Eannan Shai-huluds anyone? No, this goes too far into the crazy theories territory, but perhaps something less obvious?

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« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:39 pm »
Quote from: Curethan
Too far into crazy theories?  S'if.

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« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:45 pm »
Quote from: Francis Buck
Quote from: lockesnow
what does xiuhianni racial characteristics mean?

Judging by their name and (admittedly vague) physical description, combined with the fact that they remained in the east, I think it's fair to assume the Xiuhianni are probably the "Asians" of Bakkerverse. It would be cool to see what their culture is like, and in particular what they do or do not know of all the events taking place around the Three Seas. It seems odd that they would be ignorant of the fact that there are legions of evil rape aliens trying to kill the majority of the people on the planet. Perhaps they'll send an envoy in the next trilogy? Though we don't really know how far or close their civilization is beyond the Kayarsus (sp?), and it seems like the other four tribes have been completely isolated from whatever is east and south of the continent they're on (I'd assume the north just becomes an arctic, and thus less populated).

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« Reply #11 on: May 29, 2013, 04:58:54 pm »
Quote from: Madness
Bargil mentioned that the Inchoroi have translucent skin. I've always pegged the Inchoroi as the perpetrator's of Chanv. Why wouldn't this species with very specific control of their genome/connectome (Sebastien Hueng's fancy word for the brain as a culmination of neural structures) created a substance to prolong life and make them smarter? Of course, this is assuming some biological homogeneity among the species of the Void, that it would be easily adaptable to and function the same on humans.

Also, concerning the Xiuhianni, let's take the perspective that of those Inchoroi who survived the fall, many of them interacted with the Five Tribes of Men beyond the Kayarsus (spelling's good, Francis) while fighting the Cuno-Inchoroi Wars. They created the Tusk, added at least the False Men Imperative, and gave the Halaroi Chorae.

Now, for whatever reason - conspiracy theories should abound - the Xiuhianni don't join the Four Tribes in the Breaking of the Gates.

I would assume that there is an entire civilization of Man beyond the Kayarsus, likely with ritual belief surrounding Inchoroi worship - with or without the Consult's actual intervention, which is itself very likely probable.

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« Reply #12 on: May 29, 2013, 04:59:01 pm »
Quote from: Auriga
Quote from: Francis Buck
Judging by their name and (admittedly vague) physical description, combined with the fact that they remained in the east, I think it's fair to assume the Xiuhianni are probably the "Asians" of Bakkerverse.

Yep. Their racial features are obviously Asiatic (the descriptions of Xonghis, such as "squinting eyes" and "his Xiuhianni blood was more visible in daylight"). Their location in the distant east, and what we know of their language, also gives an Asian impression.

Quote
It seems odd that they would be ignorant of the fact that there are legions of evil rape aliens trying to kill the majority of the people on the planet.

It must be quite a terrifying shock for the rest of the planet. In Eärwa, at least the leadership knows what's going on with the Consult, and has a clue why their babies start dying by the millions. On the other hand, the people in Eänna have never heard of the No-God and have absolutely no idea what is happening.

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« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2013, 04:59:09 pm »
Quote from: Sideris
But this brings questions up about the 144K legend, etc. What about the rest of the planet? There are surely millions more round the globe. I find it hard to believe the whole human population of the planet is confined to Earwa. Didn't Scott make mention of this in the interview where he revealed the Tusk's creators being the Inchoroi?

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« Reply #14 on: May 29, 2013, 04:59:17 pm »
Quote from: Curethan
Sranc ate em all.