The Second Apocalypse

Earwa => The Aspect-Emperor => The Unholy Consult => Topic started by: Francis Buck on July 10, 2017, 03:16:46 am

Title: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Francis Buck on July 10, 2017, 03:16:46 am
Given the ambiguity of the ending, a surprisingly large number of the core cast may still be alive, in one form or another. On the other hand, virtually everyone could be dead. Since we are unlikely to get an answer to this whatsoever until the next book, I imagine there will be a lot of discussion on the possibilities.

In terms of who survived Golgotterath, I think there are some which are nearly guaranteed, at least as much as anything can be guaranteed in this series.

My own thoughts, after only a cursory re-reading of select scenes, is listed roughly from most to least likely:

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Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Cuttlefish on July 10, 2017, 03:34:17 am
I think I agree with your list, with two exceptions.

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Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: lastborn on July 10, 2017, 08:15:24 am
Meppa, definitely.

Another plot point "dropped" so to speak is Simas, the skin-spy with a soul.


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Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Walter on July 10, 2017, 12:59:50 pm
Moe Jr.'s Scylvendi have Excursi, but I don't know if those work once the No-God is in direct control.  If they don't, that host is in incredible danger this close to the Horde.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 10, 2017, 02:06:28 pm
I feel pretty confident that somehow Akka, Esmenet, Mimara and Akka Jr. are all still alive.

Serwa seems dead, as are the rest of the kids, I think, maybe Kyutas lives.

Cnaiur is "dead" but like Kellhus, I don't think that is the last we'll see of him.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: lastborn on July 10, 2017, 11:09:47 pm
Yeah, the description of Cnaiur in TGO definitely makes him out to be "one who falls as hunger"

Quote
All is illumined before the Eye. It knows no shadow—the same as It knows no past, no future. She sees him, Cnaiür urs Skiötha, the legend, and she cannot look away. She sees him for the soul he is.
“I am a fool in this,” the old Wizard retorts. “No different than you.”
The Scylvendi demon grins. It is like staring into a furnace, watching him. Heat pinches her cheeks. She squints against the blowing of unseen sparks. The sins of the Wizard—grievous though they may be—are but trifles compared to the atrocities wrought by this one man.

Apologies for bad formatting.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Simas Polchias on July 11, 2017, 12:46:56 am
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Considering all that scary circus just before the situation (I've finished TUC few minutes ago), it seems
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Dunno what to think though.
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Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Wilshire on July 11, 2017, 02:09:55 pm
As long as we're within the TUC subforum, you guys can drop the spoiler tags now. Thanks for observing :)
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Simas Polchias on July 11, 2017, 04:46:24 pm
Aw, that's a relief about spoilers. Reading all 9 pages of "[TUC SPOILERS] Thoughts about the overall story, ending etc  New" was like the Tiny Ordeal. Click, click, click.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Redeagl on July 12, 2017, 05:16:28 pm
My list of the Survivors
Akka
Akka the Younger
Moe the Younger
Esmenet
Mimara
Crabicus
Meppa?? ( possible)
Kayutas?? ( possible)
Kelmomas ( The No-God)
Aurax
4 Dûnyain

Also, what exactly happened to Mek?  feel like I didn't pay enough attention to him.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Hiro on July 12, 2017, 05:21:05 pm
My list of the Survivors
Akka
Akka the Younger
Moe the Younger
Esmenet
Mimara
Crabicus
Meppa?? ( possible)
Kayutas?? ( possible)
Kelmomas ( The No-God)
Aurax
4 Dûnyain

Also, what exactly happened to Mek?  feel like I didn't pay enough attention to him.

Mek was beheaded by Kellhus.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 12, 2017, 05:22:19 pm
Mek was beheaded by Kellhus.

Yeah, Kellhus/Ajokli.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Werthead on July 12, 2017, 06:20:15 pm
It's blink and you miss it, but Kayutas carries Serwa's body ("her sister's body") out of the Ark as Mimara is climbing up towards No-Kellhus. From that I'm assuming she's dead but Kayutas was still alive at that moment.

I'm more interested in what happened to the Sun Lance, as, with the Heron Spear still MIA (although I suspect the Scylvendi may have it somewhere) that could be quite useful.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Wilshire on July 12, 2017, 06:35:14 pm
It's blink and you miss it, but Kayutas carries Serwa's body ("her sister's body") out of the Ark as Mimara is climbing up towards No-Kellhus. From that I'm assuming she's dead but Kayutas was still alive at that moment.

I'm more interested in what happened to the Sun Lance, as, with the Heron Spear still MIA (although I suspect the Scylvendi may have it somewhere) that could be quite useful.
I think the contention is that she was not yet dead inside and given Cniaur reappearance, its possible she's alive.

Sun Lance was connected to the ship. Barring some Kellhusian developments into electricity, it might not be as useful as the Spear. That said, some contrivance of soul-bound mechanisms might do the trick.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: False Man on July 12, 2017, 06:40:45 pm
Some saw the winged horror of the Horde-General flitting down and about, then darting like a sparrow into obscurity. Some saw the Aspect-Emperor slip like a coin from a slashed purse, only to vanish into the oblivion of sorcerous light. Some saw the Spear topple out into the void, trailing a rope attached to some kind of metallic coffer ...

The box is probably its source of energy but I don't understand if the box is attached to the Horn or if the Sun Lance just fell into the void.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 12, 2017, 07:09:16 pm
Some saw the winged horror of the Horde-General flitting down and about, then darting like a sparrow into obscurity. Some saw the Aspect-Emperor slip like a coin from a slashed purse, only to vanish into the oblivion of sorcerous light. Some saw the Spear topple out into the void, trailing a rope attached to some kind of metallic coffer ...

The box is probably its source of energy but I don't understand if the box is attached to the Horn or if the Sun Lance just fell into the void.

I read it as the whole apparatus fell.  It could plausibly have been carried off by someone, but we don't really know who is actually left...
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Redeagl on July 12, 2017, 08:46:19 pm
It's blink and you miss it, but Kayutas carries Serwa's body ("her sister's body") out of the Ark as Mimara is climbing up towards No-Kellhus. From that I'm assuming she's dead but Kayutas was still alive at that moment.

I'm more interested in what happened to the Sun Lance, as, with the Heron Spear still MIA (although I suspect the Scylvendi may have it somewhere) that could be quite useful.
When first teleporting to Ishterebinth in TGO, isn't it mentioned that Metagnosotic cants tire her quickly?  That and her state made me a bit sure about her death.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Walter on July 13, 2017, 03:12:45 am
I think Kayutas also says something like "anyone can see you are about to die" when he gives her the Cindersword.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Cuttlefish on July 13, 2017, 03:34:38 am
I think two things may imply Serwa might've survived;

She seems to think "father" after debris falls on her, and Kayutas carrying "her body". I think it's through Mimara's perspective that we see her body being carried, but Mimara might be mistaken in assuming that she is dead instead of passed out, and well, from a meta standpoint, what could be the reason for mentioning Serwa's body at all? Of course, it could just be an off-handed way to remind us that Kayutas lost his sister, whom he loved, and that Kayutas is still alive, but it might also be implying that it is not the end of Serwa. Like many things, we'll see the definitive answer in the next book.

Edit: Reading back, the section refers to her body being "blasted". Yeah, that convinces me that she is gone for good.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Heavenfall on July 13, 2017, 09:15:39 am
She was blasted by Heron Spear v.2 before, Mimara doesn't know the difference. From the scene where Serwa fell it sounded like the roof collapsing in on her. She probably teleported away and fainted from exhaustion. Otherwise how could they possibly have gotten to her body so fast? Skulthul was still alive and kicking as far as I could tell.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Cüréthañ on July 13, 2017, 10:10:57 am
Her arm got salted by the hundredth stone. She is toast, imo.

But ... Mimara saw her as Ciphrang with the Eye, so maybe there is some slim hope that she is even more bad ass than we know.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Cuttlefish on July 13, 2017, 12:35:37 pm
She was blasted by Heron Spear v.2 before, Mimara doesn't know the difference. From the scene where Serwa fell it sounded like the roof collapsing in on her. She probably teleported away and fainted from exhaustion. Otherwise how could they possibly have gotten to her body so fast? Skulthul was still alive and kicking as far as I could tell.

Fair point about getting to her body; it's not like they could've dug the debris in that short span of time
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: ThoughtsOfThelli on July 14, 2017, 01:11:18 pm
I agree that Achamian, Esmenet, Mimara and "Akka Jr." survived. Same for Moënghus the Younger, Aurax, the Boy (who was probably at a safe enough distance during the events of this book, given that we don't see him at all) and the remaining 4 members of the Dûnyain Consult.
Kayûtas might have survived if he was close enough to Saccarees to be teleported away/if Serwa was still alive at that point and able to teleport away. I personally believe Serwa died, even if she was not quite dead by the end of the book. She was covered in burns and lost at least part of an arm to a Chorae, so I don't think she lasted much longer.
Kelmomas is "alive" in a way, as he still exists as the No-God, but Anasûrimbor Kelmomas as we knew him is gone.
Kellhus is definitely dead, so is Cnaïur, though I agree with the people saying that we haven't seen the last of them and they might be seen again in the Outside.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Walter on July 14, 2017, 01:53:07 pm
Agree with ThoughtsOfThelli on those.

I go back and forth on Aurang.  On the one hand, the author goes out of the way so that he doesn't die on screen.  On the other, the Inchoroi would be possessed by the No-God at this point, right?  So what would the narrative importance of one more wingless body even be?
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Wilshire on July 14, 2017, 01:57:16 pm
the Inchoroi would be possessed by the No-God at this point, right?
I don't think that's the case. The Inchoroi helped direct and coordinate the armies. Only the sranc were more/less entirely enslaved by the NG. At worst, all the weapon races, but the Inchoroi always had their own agency.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 14, 2017, 01:59:39 pm
the Inchoroi would be possessed by the No-God at this point, right?
I don't think that's the case. The Inchoroi helped direct and coordinate the armies. Only the sranc were more/less entirely enslaved by the NG. At worst, all the weapon races, but the Inchoroi always had their own agency.
Well, more like agency in service to (of?) the Inverse Fire.  But that sure gets complicated quick...
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Wilshire on July 14, 2017, 02:03:27 pm
the Inchoroi would be possessed by the No-God at this point, right?
I don't think that's the case. The Inchoroi helped direct and coordinate the armies. Only the sranc were more/less entirely enslaved by the NG. At worst, all the weapon races, but the Inchoroi always had their own agency.
Well, more like agency in service to (of?) the Inverse Fire.  But that sure gets complicated quick...
lol. I'm just making a case for the difference between sranc and inchoroi as it relates to the No-God. Not going down the whole 'free will' philosophy rabbit hole.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 14, 2017, 02:06:22 pm
lol. I'm just making a case for the difference between sranc and inchoroi as it relates to the No-God. Not going down the whole 'free will' philosophy rabbit hole.

Haha, an excellent life choice, I must say...
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Walter on July 14, 2017, 02:10:43 pm
But haven't we learned the the Inchoroi *are* a weapon race?  Like, I got the impression they are a marginally smarter breed of Sranc from the conversation between the Dunyain.

I don't think there is any direct/control once the No-God is active.  Like, it destroyed the Great Ordeal in an hour or so.  What would an Inchoroi add?  It has perfect control of every Sranc, to the point where it is micromanaging them passing chorae around.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Wilshire on July 14, 2017, 02:13:37 pm
But haven't we learned the the Inchoroi *are* a weapon race?  Like, I got the impression they are a marginally smarter breed of Sranc from the conversation between the Dunyain.

I don't think there is any direct/control once the No-God is active.  Like, it destroyed the Great Ordeal in an hour or so.  What would an Inchoroi add?  It has perfect control of every Sranc, to the point where it is micromanaging them passing chorae around.

That particular Inchoroi wouldn't add much to anything, NG or no. The Consult don't need it, and he(?) was more like a pet than anything else.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 14, 2017, 02:20:56 pm
That particular Inchoroi wouldn't add much to anything, NG or no. The Consult don't need it, and he(?) was more like a pet than anything else.

Well, I think they regard it as a bit more than a pet though.

But I think it was Skafra who says they actually worship the No-God, but then again, we don't know too much about how Wracu think...
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Francis Buck on July 15, 2017, 03:30:48 am
I think the main point to take away from the Sranc ---> Inchoroi comparison is that, in reality, EVERYTHING is just "another variety of Sranc". I don't remember the exact line but the text more or less states this outright. Men themselves are a "weapon race" just as any other, driven by their own particular set of desires (and basically all the races -- Sranc, Nonmen, Inchoroi, even Gods and Dunyain -- are subject to this).

The Dunyain's vast intellect makes them no less subject to the Darkness that comes before, as illustrated by the Apocalypse of Koringhus. The Dunyain "feed" on knowledge and the domination of circumstances just as Sranc "feed" on violent congress, etc. The Mutilated see the Ark as a genuine religious object (even if they do not think of it as such). They see the Absolute as a prize, or something to be achieved, when in fact it is yet one more carrot on a stick.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 17, 2017, 12:14:43 pm
I think the main point to take away from the Sranc ---> Inchoroi comparison is that, in reality, EVERYTHING is just "another variety of Sranc". I don't remember the exact line but the text more or less states this outright. Men themselves are a "weapon race" just as any other, driven by their own particular set of desires (and basically all the races -- Sranc, Nonmen, Inchoroi, even Gods and Dunyain -- are subject to this).

The Dunyain's vast intellect makes them no less subject to the Darkness that comes before, as illustrated by the Apocalypse of Koringhus. The Dunyain "feed" on knowledge and the domination of circumstances just as Sranc "feed" on violent congress, etc. The Mutilated see the Ark as a genuine religious object (even if they do not think of it as such). They see the Absolute as a prize, or something to be achieved, when in fact it is yet one more carrot on a stick.

Indeed and taking it a bit further, perhaps what the whole issue of "darkness" encroaching on Kellhus is meant to show how "approaching" the Absolute is still leagues away from achieving the Absolute.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Redeagl on July 18, 2017, 05:14:02 pm
I thought that the NG enslaves everything soulless which the Inchoroi are obviously not.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: H on July 18, 2017, 05:20:26 pm
I thought that the NG enslaves everything soulless which the Inchoroi are obviously not.
Well, we don't really know that the No-God ensalves anything, though.  Only that it can somehow command Sranc, Bashrags and Wracu.

The Inchoroi aren't enslaved to the No-God, they are enslaved to the Inverse Fire, which causes them to worship the No-God as a savior.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Anaxophus on July 23, 2017, 06:20:35 pm
Where is this device referred to as the Sun Lance?  Maybe I missed it.  I only remember that they thought it was the Heron Spear but the colour of the laser beam was not the same as in the dreams (meaning it's not the Heron Spear but something similar).
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: ThoughtsOfThelli on July 23, 2017, 06:32:07 pm
Where is this device referred to as the Sun Lance?  Maybe I missed it.  I only remember that they thought it was the Heron Spear but the colour of the laser beam was not the same as in the dreams (meaning it's not the Heron Spear but something similar).

Can't remember if it was in the text, but the glossary definitely mentions the Sun Lance (I'll edit this post later if I can place it).
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: codebread on July 23, 2017, 09:26:02 pm
Edit: Reading back, the section refers to her body being "blasted". Yeah, that convinces me that she is gone for good.

I took "blasted" as "blasted by sin / the Mark". I believe Akka is described this way several times when Mimara looks at him with the Eye as well. If this is the way it was meant to be read, I'm inclined to believe she's alive.

Where is this device referred to as the Sun Lance?  Maybe I missed it.  I only remember that they thought it was the Heron Spear but the colour of the laser beam was not the same as in the dreams (meaning it's not the Heron Spear but something similar).

Can't remember if it was in the text, but the glossary definitely mentions the Sun Lance (I'll edit this post later if I can place it).

It's the Sister of the Heron Spear. Aurang used it against Ishterebinth. (Glossary - Black Iron Seat)
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Woden on July 23, 2017, 10:33:42 pm
Serwa could be dead, but I bet that she is going to be more "hunger" than "fodder".
Remember that Mimara saw her like a ciphrang.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: TheCulminatingApe on July 24, 2017, 08:11:20 pm
Serwa could be dead, but I bet that she is going to be more "hunger" than "fodder".
Remember that Mimara saw her like a ciphrang.

Serwa was mortally wounded (according to Kayutas) by a laser weapon, then had one of her hands/ arms salted off, and was then buried by collapsing debris.  Even if she somehow teleported out, I don't see how she can have lived
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Woden on July 24, 2017, 09:05:45 pm
Serwa could be dead, but I bet that she is going to be more "hunger" than "fodder".
Remember that Mimara saw her like a ciphrang.

Serwa was mortally wounded (according to Kayutas) by a laser weapon, then had one of her hands/ arms salted off, and was then buried by collapsing debris.  Even if she somehow teleported out, I don't see how she can have lived

Yes, I think she's dead but maybe we will see her again not in Earwa but at the Outside as some kind of cute Ciphrang.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: profgrape on July 24, 2017, 10:15:19 pm
Serwa could be dead, but I bet that she is going to be more "hunger" than "fodder".
Remember that Mimara saw her like a ciphrang.

Serwa was mortally wounded (according to Kayutas) by a laser weapon, then had one of her hands/ arms salted off, and was then buried by collapsing debris.  Even if she somehow teleported out, I don't see how she can have lived

Yes, I think she's dead but maybe we will see her again not in Earwa but at the Outside as some kind of cute Ciphrang.

I thought she was dead when the roof came down.  But the fact that Kayutas was carrying her body later makes me wonder. 
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Woden on July 24, 2017, 10:29:50 pm
If not dead yet, she was dying or so she thought when went to fight the dragon.
But even the very wise cannot see all ends, lol.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: littlegrice on August 01, 2017, 04:48:56 am
Serwa could be dead, but I bet that she is going to be more "hunger" than "fodder".
Remember that Mimara saw her like a ciphrang.

Serwa was mortally wounded (according to Kayutas) by a laser weapon, then had one of her hands/ arms salted off, and was then buried by collapsing debris.  Even if she somehow teleported out, I don't see how she can have lived

Yes, I think she's dead but maybe we will see her again not in Earwa but at the Outside as some kind of cute Ciphrang.

I thought she was dead when the roof came down.  But the fact that Kayutas was carrying her body later makes me wonder.

Yeah, the Dunyain are a cold-blooded lot.  Unless Kayutas inherited a larger portion of the mother than we know, I just don't see him carrying around a dead body on a battlefield.  And didn't she take some dead nonman ash?  Who KNOWS the limits to that stuff.

Survivors of the Ordeal
  1.  Achamian, Esmenet, Mimara, and baby.  Achamian, after receiving a mouthful of dead person ash, just hauls ass and doesn't look back.
  2.  Kayutas and Serwa.  Either with Achamian(I don't think so, but possible), the Mandate Grand Master, or (my crazy theory) they hide in Golgotterath while she regains her strength for the Meta-Gnostic.  Hiding where no one could possibly be?  Sounds pretty fuckin Dunyain to me.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: The Sharmat on August 05, 2017, 08:04:12 pm
Given how Koringhus reacted to the Qirri it was pretty cold hearted of Mimara to give some to a half-dunyain.

Also I'm pretty sure Cnaiür is still around as some kind of very frustrated incarnate hell god.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Madness on August 06, 2017, 01:51:33 pm
Bakker's answers on the AMA seemed to indicate that Serwa's not dead? And that some other principals of the retreating Ordeal also live... at least the weeks post-"Disaster at Golgotterath."
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: The Sharmat on August 06, 2017, 05:28:22 pm
Watch Serwa be alive in the next book only to succumb to her wound in the second chapter.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: ThoughtsOfThelli on August 06, 2017, 05:39:14 pm
Watch Serwa be alive in the next book only to succumb to her wound in the second chapter.

Oh, please no. I'd rather have her be mentioned as dead in the beginning of TNG than that. But, of course, knowing Bakker, your theory is far more likely... :-\
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: The Sharmat on August 06, 2017, 06:27:57 pm
Nice symmetry to the course of Sorweel's character in UC.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Wilshire on June 12, 2019, 07:25:17 pm
I've decided to operate under the assumption that Serwa lived, unless she doesn't appear in further books.

That said, I think most of the evidence suggests that she's dead, however since there is enough doubt and I like her, I'm going with Alive.

This may be in part because its now amusing to misinterpret the text's intended meaning - I suspect her body was brought out for the reader to avoid this type of Cnaiur-Was-Alive-The-Whole-Time speculation.

Kayutas carrying around a dead body doesn't make sense, from a world-building perspective, and I like the thought that "blasted" is seen through TJE as a damned soul rather than her physical form.

Mostly dead, as we all know, means partially alive ;) . Besides, she still has to have Sorweel's baby.

She can die in childbirth, we'll name it Serweel, after herself, her namesake, and her father (also a pun on surreal because its ridiculous, but definitely happening.).
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Francis Buck on June 13, 2019, 09:59:56 am
She can die in childbirth, we'll name it Serweel, after herself, her namesake, and her father (also a pun on surreal because its ridiculous, but definitely happening.).

Serweel needs to be a thing.

Unfortunately I have a feeling that if Serwa bears any children, they will be of the half Nonman variety, and probably several of them at once, given the Dunyain female's genetics. But who knows, maybe a Dunyain woman can bear children from more than one father at a time...? Stranger things have happened.

Also looking back at this original OP, I have no idea why I thought Mimara's survival was a 'coin flip', since at this point I no longer remember not being 100% confidant that she (along with Akka, Esmi, and baby) survived. Otherwise it's the same, other than that I'm perhaps slightly less inclined to believe Aurang lived, even though his death is still suspiciously written to me. Feels like a door RSB left open for himself, just in case.

In the spirit of posterity, I'd also definitely add motherfucking Shauriatas to the list of "survivors" with zero hesitation. I'm completely convinced that he -- or it -- never went anywhere, but rather the Mutilated are now basically just upgraded versions of the Larvals.

The showdown in the Golden Room was as much 'Shauriatas vs Ajokli' as it was 'Mutilated vs Kellhus'.
Title: Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Survivors
Post by: Wilshire on June 13, 2019, 12:18:01 pm
 I thought 50/50 on Mimara seemed an odd choice. In my mind, shes probably the most important character left alive.

Generally speaking though, given the text and Bakker's commentary afterwards, I think he left a lot of things open (or potentially open) on purpose. He needs options ;) .