Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

Messages - Ciogli

Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6
General Earwa / Re: TSACast (SA Podcast)
« on: February 01, 2017, 11:33:58 pm »
I am still waiting on the cast, we have been waiting on the TGO cast for half a year. I have a nice if that is what it will take to get it moving.

General Earwa / Re: To MG.... [TUC Spoilers]
« on: January 24, 2017, 10:02:39 am »
Do the Nonmen play a significant role in this book? There were scarcely a dozen Intact and then Oirunal dies, the last Tsonos is dead and without that will they follow the lead of another? There were apparently many Tall in the mere and hundreds that barely hung on above. One of the best things about ishteribinth was the answering of questions about the Nonmen, does that continue in this volume?

The Great Ordeal / Re: Reassessing The Great Ordeal
« on: January 14, 2017, 05:18:12 am »
I feel that it would have been natural for Maithanet to have a family of his own, their would have been good reasons to do so and only Kellhus would have stopped it. Since they would have only have been a quarter Dunyain they would be less dangerous. I hope that is one of the Revelations of the next series.

The Great Ordeal / Re: Reassessing The Great Ordeal
« on: January 14, 2017, 12:36:36 am »

My biggest problem was the lack of Maithanet and, I'm not saying that Maitha is Darth Mail, I'm just saying that he was massively underused in this series.

Bro, Maithenet died at the hands of the WLW at the end of WLW. Its how Esmi becomes Empress again and restored to her home. How would you expect Maitha to play a role?
I know that Maithanet died in the prior book, that was the problem, he is such a great character that we get far to little of. He is the second most powerful person in the empire and is only a side character, from the Holy war to the Ordeal we only get glimpses of him. I think it would have made the storyline better if we followed Maithanet around to see what he was up to, with a base of power in Sumna and the thousand temples behind him. His own Dunyain insight about the world and his brother, I would rather have read that than about Kelmommas.

The Great Ordeal / Reassessing The Great Ordeal
« on: January 13, 2017, 06:15:10 am »
When I first finished TGO I did not know how to feel about the book, I was unsure if it was the best or worst of the series. Since then I have been meaning to do a reread but have not gotten around, at Christmas I got a gift card and bought the audiobook. The parts that I liked I really loved this time around and the parts I didn't like I now enjoyed, although not loved. 

The storyline of Momen dragged the first time, Kelmommas is an annoying character, his madness is not interesting unlike Inrilatas. His continual dupping of Esmenet only aggravated me, this brilliant character is being dragged to her and the empires destruction by that little shit. This time the parts that did not involve Kelmommas were actually good. Fanayal and his losing battle with Psatma and the growing dismay of Malowebi , how he could see how fucked he was by fate and the growing sense of doom. Esmenet and her sense of inadequacy in the face of impossible odds, she rose to the challenge only to be smacked down by the Gods and the product of her own womb. My biggest problem was the lack of Maithanet and, I'm not saying that Maitha is Darth Mail, I'm just saying that he was massively underused in this series.

Now the greatest shortcoming of the Ordeal storyline was the sense that it was the opening act to the real battle. The battle of Dagliash was great but the feeling pervaded that was only setup, my only disappointments were the part where Aurang is about to fight Saccares and then runs off, the Consult had finally shown itself then flew off. Saved for the true battle at Golgotterath I suppose , a sorcerous duel between two Gnostic sorcerers is something not seen yet. Proyas was interesting, but he was a butterfly in its cocoon and not yet come out in his new form. Interestingly Zsoronga was with Proyas and Kayutas and when the eruption happened they escaped the fallout, with the impending destruction of his line he is now Satakhan of High Holy Zeum. Kellhus reveals both his madness and his battle with the No God, he thought his own race terrible, seeing their great folly.  The revelation that there was no Kellhus, that who he e is completely a function of local circumstances. Only his saving Esmenet belies this, it shows that a sliver of the original Kellhus that in love with her during the Holy war still survives. This may be the strangest case of unrequited love in all of fiction, Kellhus the ultimate manipulator truly loves Esmenet who worships but does not truly love him, she in turn loves Achamian who despises them both for their betrayal.

In Ishual not much action happens but it might be my favorite storyline, the exposition peels back the layers of the Dunyain. We meet the Survivor and the Boy, who happen to not only be the only survivors of the Dunyain but also direct descendants of Kellhus.  I wish more of the Order had survived, some of the Pragma perhaps but at the very least an unbound female. It would have been nice to see Dunyain manipulation coming from a young girl, a full one that has no world born blood. The battle for control between the two siblings Koringhus and Mimara was, they were both mad and yet it was he who succumbed to her. He was a prodigy in the Order like his father before him, at it would seem that the Boy might be the greatest still except his emotions still thrived and so was deemed Defective by the Dunyain Assessor. He would have lived out his days is the Unmasking Room strapped to a gurney, it seemed that Fate brought Akka and Mimara to Ishual simply to retrieve him. He would have the greatest of the Dunyains physical and mental gifts and yet could still feel some emotions. Only his hand marred his perfection. The boy clung to his father and his father could see the desire for closeness in his face, when he ran from the Skinspy he suddenly started crying and he did not know why. His father saved him for unknown reasons, the greatest of the Dunyain, the only child to be so  spared and so burdened for years in the Thousand Thousand Halls he saved the boy. And then Akka and Mimara arrive to save him again, it would seem that Fate has much in store for him. He and his twin cousins, if the NoGod walks then they will be born stillborn and legend says that all with the Judging Eye also give birth to stillborn children. Only the Anagke the Whore of Fate can save them. I believe the Boy will find his way back to Achamian and Mimara, the trio has a date with the Ordeal.

The most awe inspiring storyline was of course Ishteribinth, from the revelation that Sorweel was supposed to hate Serwa and Moenghus, to their first glimpse of the Weeping Mountain which was carved into the very shape of a penitent man. Emwama that have literally been bred into Hobbits to better serve their insane masters. The melding of Sorweel to the Amoilas so that he was Cunuroi in truth, the Nonmen seemed to be part insane asylum, pare prison, all decked out in the guise of inhuman kings. Oirunal the Lastborn, With, the youngest and least of his ancient race, they had forbidden him martial pursuits so that he could record their dissolution in relative sanitary.  Confirmation that the Consult had indeed come to rule the last mansion in the guise of a descendant of Nin Janjin the traitor. Since the Nonmen have always been my favorite part the dive into their history was awesome, yet to see such greatness on its final legs soon to be lost to history was a lot depressing. What seemed the first Nonman King who dug the first mansion in the great Kayursus, Will, house primordial. This is the same as Moria in if we ever get there. The boatman and his descent into the Holy Deep, who turns out to be the wicked uncle of Cujara Common the greatest Nonman King. He was a bigger asshole than I suspected, his antics practically drove Nin Janjin into the Inchroi camp. Maybe it was because he was the product of incest, his parents seemed like assholes to. Lastborn giving his life so that Oirunas might remember himself once more so he could fuck shit up. I think Serwa's plan was to sing mundanely before the king and so bring him under her sway and free herself that way. Once released  she could sing her arcane song. It was amusing to see both the contempt and terror that the Nonmen held the Hundred.

The reveal of Cnaiur and his control of the Scylvendi at last King of Tribes, it would seem that he kept his identity secret so Kellhus and the empire took no notice of what was going on in the steppe.  That is why the Scylvendi never attacked the weakened empire, they held themselves back for the Ordeal. The fact that Cnaiur kept the Skinspy for two decades says that he loved it as he can love anyone, also it is in the guise of a beautiful woman and yet has great strength along with a penis means he hit the lottery. No one will question his sexuality and yet he can succumb to someone stronger than himself. If they had avoided significant bloodshed then over twenty years they could have replenished their ranks, the Scylvendi are now at full strength. It seems that Cnaiur would need allies or those scared of him to become King of Tribes, twenty years of political intrigue across the steppe. Since Kellhus would doubtless have spies watching the steppe for this possibility, Cnaiur has become canny in old age. I wonder if they have sorcerers in the Scylvendi, since they have the Few, it would make sense to train them in Gnostic sorcery, another dagger for the Ordeal.

A couple questions that I had, the mysterious circles that have been talked about on the maps, could they be the result of ancient Scalding. Set off during the ancient Nonmen and Inchroi wars, Bakker hinted that ancient accounts of those times are what allowed him to know radiation sickness symptoms. During the Ishual chapters Koringhus thinks of the legion within similar to that described by Leto all when he struggled with possession, disparate pieces of himself that could be yoked to his ends. Leto made a deal with his inner selves so that he was simply the face of a inner community that did his bidding, Koringhus thinks much the same except because he was broken the pieces were more obvious. Just before his death with the Leap of Faith he has a curious thought, to avoid damnation he will make a sideways step, this seemed similar to the Nonmen and their theory of hiding from the Afterlife. In the False Sun Titirga talked of hiding his voice and finding oblivion, Harrapior talked to Serwa of Emlidis and his saying that finding oblivion was like the flight of an arrow and just as difficult. Maybe this is the same place that the Nonmen got their idea, someone with the Judging Eye.

General Earwa / Re: Nonmen and Vampires
« on: October 27, 2016, 12:45:13 am »
The Emwama were something else, I had the image of them as native Americans in my head. I never would have guessed them to be enslaved Hobbits, enslaved so thoroughly that they literally have been bred like dogs to be perfect slaves. So much so that they are nearly a separate species from humans, it is like those ant species that farm cattydidds. Nil' Giccas himself started the harvesting of Emwama fat to laddle over himself, they exist only to consumed at the whims of their masters who they consider godlike.

General Earwa / Re: Nonmen and Vampires
« on: October 26, 2016, 07:40:00 pm »
Probably since the First Apocalypse, they traded with the Norsiria, that was the last time when most of their number were sane.

General Earwa / Re: Nonmen and Vampires
« on: October 25, 2016, 05:46:36 am »
No problem, this place only gets traffic on the TGO forum it seems like. Maybe people are still digesting the book and they will come back to play later.

General Earwa / Nonmen and Vampires
« on: October 11, 2016, 03:11:38 am »
It struck me as I was watching The Strain, the similarities between between the lore of Vampires and what we know of the Nonmen. In both they are an ancient race that surpass humans in all aspects, there immortal culture is a source of both awe and fear for humans. They are both more physically capable and more beautiful than man.

Immortal races that are so old that only rumour and legend surround them, they are both envied And feared by mortals.  The Nonmen are pale skinned men who live in underground cities away from the punishing hands of the sun, while Vampires are allergic to the touch of the sun. For men the stories of the Nonmen are at the very root of mannish history, they were the very reason that men came to Earwa . But for Vampires there legends haunt almost every culture around the globe, they can be seen between the cracks of almost every epic tradition.

They both sustain themselves on the suffering of lesser beings, for Vampires it is the lifeblood of mortals themselves, for them to live there victims must die. It is the ultimate in a predator and prey relationship. For the Nonmen the relationship between themselves and there victims is much more complex.  There very immortality has rendered them insane, the very act of violence against there victims is what allows them attain some measure of there ancient selves. It is only in predatory violence that the strongest live for a short time until the Dolour once again takes them.

For the Nonmen there subterranean mansions are haunted refugees, the ancient home of there race where they can be safe from the grasping hands of the sun. But the horrors of the past render them haunted places even for the greatest among them. The tragic weight of there illustrious past is carved into the very flesh of there home, not only can they not escape it, but it is a constant reminder of who they truly week. For Vampires home is a drive from the deadly embrace of the sun, they to dig deep into the flesh of the earth where they rest in darkness. But for them they must literally rest in the soil of there homeland, a coffin filled with there past so that they remain strong, literally carrying the past with them.

For both there physical perfection both attracts and repels, for Vampires beauty acts as honey to attract there prey, perfection that does not fade with time. For the Nonmen beauty is integral to there being, it is not a snare as much as it is a ruler with which they display there superiority over mortal men. A lasting youth which has cost them all which they most loved in there mortal life and which forever casts them in the mold of there greatest glory.

For both the compass of there lives spans the breadth of human history, living ledgers of all that has been lost to the fog of history. In both that memory has become a weary burden, in one that burden has inspired bitterness and in the other it has caused madness.

The only thing the Nonmen lack are fangs and the ability to sustain numbers, for them each loss is irreplaceable. As Sarcellus said " age is power in this world".

General Earwa / Re: TSACast (SA Podcast)
« on: October 10, 2016, 11:23:45 pm »
What equipment do I need for a cast?

The Great Ordeal / Re: (TGO Spoilers) Son of the Survivor
« on: October 01, 2016, 08:20:02 pm »
But if it was the hand their would be no need for the assessor, anyone could see the crippled hand, the way Koringhus remembered the encounter it was a preliminary assessment. Not final but a mature Dunyain assessment that was his craft.

The Great Ordeal / Re: (TGO Spoilers) Son of the Survivor
« on: October 01, 2016, 01:03:22 am »
I think Theliopa is illustrative of the Dunyain gnome, she had emotions but they were very stunted and muted. Kellhus said to Esmenet that they tried to breed emotions out of themselves, and the training further stunts this. The Assessor saw too much emotion in the child and labelled him defective. His physical and mental traits should be at the leading edge of the Dunyain genome considering his father and grandfather were prodigies of the Dunyain. He may have more natural ability than Kellhus himself, except he is untrained. If it was not for the Celmommian vision in TGO I would have speculated that he was the Anasurimbor that would come at the end of all things.

The Great Ordeal / Re: (TGO Spoilers) Son of the Survivor
« on: September 19, 2016, 08:43:51 am »
I think his defect was emotional, he still had familial passions, much like Kelmommas except not a psychopath. That is why the assessor deemed him defective in the crib, he could see the emotional attachment of the child. The fingers would be of no concern to the Dunyain.

Author Q&A / Maithanet
« on: July 23, 2016, 09:33:46 pm »
Two questions about Martha, the first is was he one of the Few ? He seems to recognize Akka as a sorcerer in Sumna. And the second is did he have any children of his own, it spend natural for him to have his own brood and easier than Kellhus because he was only half Dunyain. If he spent most of his time in Sumna then he would have his own power base and more than twenty years to do this.

The Great Ordeal / Re: [TGO Spoilers] Whale Mothers
« on: July 22, 2016, 06:31:21 am »
For this if he wanted to he could invoke the Nonmen genes, with the Tall their is precedent for the enormous size. If those genes for the Tall lay dormant within the Anasurimbor line then the genes could have been activated during the breeding project and only expressed in the females. The Dunyain Elders seeing this could have selected for it to become dominant in all females. These females would be full Dunyain but of great size. They would have been selected for native intelligence like the male's, but imprisoned and maimed before their size made them unmanageable.

It is a interesting thought of what an unbound Dunyain female would be like, would they be like Oirunas or Ciogli? If they were as capable as their men has intelligent it must have been an unimaginable life for them. Think of how fast Kellhus thinks and then not be to move or speak until death, cloaked in eternal darkness. They could have calculated to the day in minutes and hours of how long this would last. The Elders must have kept them sequestered as children from all the boys, they could have guessed for themselves why their were no grown females about and sought escape or death.

Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6