[TUC SPOILERS] Who has the worst fate in the series?

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Wilshire

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« Reply #60 on: October 31, 2017, 04:04:01 pm »
Conphas as Aspect-Emperor? I'm sure Proyas and Saubon would be glad to hear that. :p
Both of them would have probably wound up dead in the holy war, I think. Conphas/Xerias had that whole thing pretty well buttoned up. They were all supposed to die before Shimeh, and certainly after that.


Oh, damn. Just realized the whole reason for the war was because of Moenghus and Maithanet, and the assassination of the Scarlet Spires Grandmaster. Without all that, no war. Hmmm, interesting.
Which brings up another thing, the Cishaurim would still be around to resist the No God, which is another point in favor for the no-dunyain-world being better off.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

Dora Vee

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« Reply #61 on: October 31, 2017, 04:34:23 pm »
Saubon definitely would be killed as he is an obvious threat. As for Proyas, it's a question of how smart/wise he wants to be. Proyas the tactician would survive. Proyas the Judge? Not likely.

Yea, I think the no-Dunyain world would mean taking the scenic route against the Consult.
Faith is the truth of passion. Since no passion is more true than another, faith is the truth of nothing.   
                          -Ajencis, the fourth analytic of man

TaoHorror

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« Reply #62 on: October 31, 2017, 06:29:20 pm »
Wow, some big if's going on here - if no Dunyain, maybe no holy war, etc. Assume they have a war ( another Shriah decides to reclaim Shimeh ). Well, assuming same Famry tactics, they would've died in the desert.
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Wilshire

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« Reply #63 on: October 31, 2017, 06:35:36 pm »
Wow, some big if's going on here - if no Dunyain, maybe no holy war, etc. Assume they have a war ( another Shriah decides to reclaim Shimeh ). Well, assuming same Famry tactics, they would've died in the desert.

Recall that the desert stuff was all planned. Conphas/Xerias planned to swoop in at the last minute and conquer everything with their actually in-tact armada (it arrives right as the Shimeh battle commences).

Anyway, yes, the whole thing is a big if. If there were no dunyain ;) , thats a pretty drastic shift.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

MSJ

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« Reply #64 on: October 31, 2017, 11:22:54 pm »
If there was no Dunyain, then there isn't a war at all. The Scarlet Spires grandmaster isn't assassinated. Which is what starts the while thing. The war was a goad set up by a Dunyain (Moenghus). So, if there was no Dunyain there wouldn't be much of a story. Maybe resumption doesn't occur because they can't find the right brain for the carapace, because Kelmommas never would have existed. If there was no Dunyain, isn't a very intriguing question, imho.
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

Wilshire

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« Reply #65 on: November 01, 2017, 02:00:15 pm »
If there was no Dunyain, then there isn't a war at all. The Scarlet Spires grandmaster isn't assassinated. Which is what starts the while thing. The war was a goad set up by a Dunyain (Moenghus). So, if there was no Dunyain there wouldn't be much of a story. Maybe resumption doesn't occur because they can't find the right brain for the carapace, because Kelmommas never would have existed. If there was no Dunyain, isn't a very intriguing question, imho.

You and I clearly have a very different view of what the Three Seas were like prior to the Dunyain. But since I mentioned all of what you said in a few posts just above this, and detailed why that makes a great story, I'm forced to assume you TL;DR my posts. Oh well, I guess.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

profgrape

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« Reply #66 on: November 01, 2017, 07:18:21 pm »
I know this thread has drifted a bit but my nominee for "worst fate" is...

...Nameless Dude in Unmasking Room Who Was Used to Train Young Kellhus

Just seems so so so boring. 




TLEILAXU

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« Reply #67 on: November 01, 2017, 09:12:29 pm »
I know this thread has drifted a bit but my nominee for "worst fate" is...

...Nameless Dude in Unmasking Room Who Was Used to Train Young Kellhus

Just seems so so so boring.
Excuse me, pragma Meigon is not unnamed.

TaoHorror

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« Reply #68 on: November 01, 2017, 09:26:49 pm »
I know this thread has drifted a bit but my nominee for "worst fate" is...

...Nameless Dude in Unmasking Room Who Was Used to Train Young Kellhus

Just seems so so so boring.
Excuse me, pragma Meigon is not unnamed.

Bringing this up is timely ... those flashbacks to Kellhus' training were my first "uh oh" moment regarding him. He was ashamed of his empathy toward the defective who was perpetually in a state of horror ( fear base -2 ) ... I'm like, what the fuck - my expectation is beyond just empathy, for which you're regarding as weakness - save the poor fucker!

Maybe a new thread ... When did you realize Kellhus was "evil"
May your death be soon, slow and painful

profgrape

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« Reply #69 on: November 02, 2017, 06:29:39 pm »
I know this thread has drifted a bit but my nominee for "worst fate" is...

...Nameless Dude in Unmasking Room Who Was Used to Train Young Kellhus

Just seems so so so boring.
Excuse me, pragma Meigon is not unnamed.
Lol.  I was actually referring to the dude whose face is opened up to study.

TLEILAXU

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« Reply #70 on: November 03, 2017, 01:49:41 am »
Right. I guess those dudes were already so dehumanized for me I couldn't consider them dudes, but now it makes sense.
Maybe a new thread ... When did you realize Kellhus was "evil"
It's funny coz' I didn't even know until the AMA that Kellhus was actually trying to save the World.

Dora Vee

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« Reply #71 on: November 03, 2017, 04:36:49 am »
Quote
When did you realize Kellhus was "evil"

When he started talking about possessing people and pretty much owning/dominating them. TBH, I didn't care about him either way for the longest time, but that changed in the Unholy Consult. Should be obvious why.
Faith is the truth of passion. Since no passion is more true than another, faith is the truth of nothing.   
                          -Ajencis, the fourth analytic of man

MSJ

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« Reply #72 on: November 03, 2017, 08:47:21 pm »
Kellhus was never "evil". He was try I to protect and save humanity. He was neither good. He was Dunayin an followed the shortest path, which led to many atrocities...

But, as MSJ predicted in a podcast before the release of TGO. He loved Esme, I admit, in his own convoluted way and she was his only darkness.
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

Dora Vee

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« Reply #73 on: November 04, 2017, 08:40:21 pm »
Quote
He was try I to protect and save humanity.

On THAT world? Honestly, there are plenty of times when I think that the world is not worth saving. Sure, I vacillate, but #teamconsult was a common sentiment for me.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2017, 08:49:29 pm by Dora Vee »
Faith is the truth of passion. Since no passion is more true than another, faith is the truth of nothing.   
                          -Ajencis, the fourth analytic of man

MSJ

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« Reply #74 on: November 04, 2017, 09:32:32 pm »
Quote from:  Dora Vee
On THAT world? Honestly, there are plenty of times when I think that the world is not worth saving. Sure, I vacillate, but #teamconsult was a common sentiment for me.

Right. But, you know Kellhus did a lot of good things as AE. He made woman equal to men. Made the treatment of slaves a lot better. I know, slavery is still bad, but its something. He thought he was the savior of Mankind. He thought that his role. The TT is laid out for us in his and Moe's talk at Kyudea. Its what he was trying to accomplish. That world might not be worth saving to you, on the outside looking in. But, what if it was where you lived? You'd probably look at what Kellhus was trying to do in a whole new light. Of course, I'm sure they now think he is the No-God, those few left from the Ordeal, anyhow.
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,