Investigating Achamian's Dreams

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Madness

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« Reply #15 on: December 10, 2013, 01:14:21 pm »
Lol.

I don't know. I'm not sure of myself...
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« Reply #16 on: April 05, 2014, 01:11:21 am »
Hope this thread continues!

With that excerpt from TUC chapter and Mimara drawing attention to the timing of Achamian's dream, I've gone back to consider the timing of the others, but I can't think of anything definite.  Timing of any/all Achamian's dreams?  Definitely something strange about all the dreams Akka has *after* Kellhus talks to Seswatha, but is there anything remarkable about the timing of dreams before? 

Wilshire

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« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2014, 07:47:45 pm »
I've only read TDTCB after this revelation, and I didn't see anything definitive yet. I think they might be some 'prediction' of the future, but only in a tangential way
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« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2014, 09:22:59 am »
There are pretty broad strokes for each book.

- Celmomian Prophecy/Meeting Kellhus
- No-God Walks/Rise of Kellhus
- Nau-Cayuti & Golgotterath/Achamian Being Seswatha
- Bury It In the Coffers/Prophet of the Past (lie becomes truth, after determining before, etc)

Can't think of one for WLW - the Dreams just seem off the rails there.

Plus the things that actually make me most curious are Achamian living Sauglish sans Seswatha anchor, young Nau-Cayuti asking who is Mimara, and Achamian Dreaming sleeping Nau-Cayuti's time and space...
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Crtha

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« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2014, 10:26:10 am »
Plus the things that actually make me most curious are Achamian living Sauglish sans Seswatha anchor, young Nau-Cayuti asking who is Mimara, and Achamian Dreaming sleeping Nau-Cayuti's time and space...

His dreams first go off the rails after Kellhus interviews his Seswatha homonculous. 
In AE, he becomes unanchored from Seswatha after quirri.  It's possible that agents were slipping minute amounts while he was in hermitude at his tower; Kosoter was based around there for 10 years before TJE.
Cleric has something to do with his dreams, in my mind.  I think there is a very good reason that Cleric dumps CC's ash before sacrificing himself to become their new supply.
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« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2014, 12:16:45 pm »
Qirri to qirri.  Who will Akka have to kill to get more?  He's going to show up in Ishterebinth like a hungry heroin addict with the voice of a god!

Wilshire

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« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2014, 01:35:46 pm »
I haven't studied the dreams pre/post Kellhus' interaction, but that scene and the results of it are a linchpin. So many important moments are shrouded in mystery.

Also still not sure why it was necessary to dump out the Qirri, but thats for a different topic.
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« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2014, 01:00:53 am »
Perhaps worth noting that Eskeles complains "Sauglish again!" in TJE.
If Akka's dreams are getting manipulated directly, why are other mandati suffering linked changes in their own dreams.  (Assuming its a hint and not misdirection.)
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« Reply #23 on: April 25, 2014, 12:53:19 pm »
Could have been that Kellhus' manipulations affected everyone.

Does everyone dream the same dreams each night? Like all the dreamers are sitting in the same theatre watching the same thing? Or do they all dream their own segment of Seswatha's life each night?
I can't remember, and the answer great effects my theory here.
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« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2014, 01:44:59 pm »
Could have been that Kellhus' manipulations affected everyone.

Does everyone dream the same dreams each night? Like all the dreamers are sitting in the same theatre watching the same thing? Or do they all dream their own segment of Seswatha's life each night?
I can't remember, and the answer great effects my theory here.

Love it!  Maybe he does it via the heart?  Could be that all Mandati/Swayali are permanently linked to the object--maybe there will be a moment in TUC when Kellhus will use the heart to possess all the remaining Graspers, like Mog does with Sranc, and have them do one massive group cant!

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« Reply #25 on: May 02, 2014, 01:40:39 am »
A true chorus, with absolute meaning fed from Kellhus' mind to the mouth of his hundreds.

And because your crazy inspires my own:

Wonder if mundane men could be used to anchor meaning with utterals? More likely, a chorus of school(wo)men all singing  ONE cant, with dozens of utteral/inutterals creating insane magic.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2014, 01:42:28 am by Wilshire »
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« Reply #26 on: May 05, 2014, 12:56:43 pm »
Wonder if mundane men could be used to anchor meaning with utterals? More likely, a chorus of school(wo)men all singing  ONE cant, with dozens of utteral/inutterals creating insane magic.

Eleazarus and Iyokus definitely talk about "Concerts" in TWP.
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« Reply #27 on: May 05, 2014, 06:08:29 pm »
Wonder if mundane men could be used to anchor meaning with utterals? More likely, a chorus of school(wo)men all singing  ONE cant, with dozens of utteral/inutterals creating insane magic.
Eleazarus and Iyokus definitely talk about "Concerts" in TWP.
Concerts, yes, but I always imagined that each was singing their own song. More like a collection of individuals. I'm talking about squads of schoolmen bent to singing the same song.
I imagine a SS concert consisting of dragon heads, kamakazi fire sparrows, etc. A combination of individual spells. I was thinking more along the lines of, to stick with this example, all of them singing to create a single enormous dragon.

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« Reply #28 on: May 05, 2014, 09:06:02 pm »
A true chorus, with absolute meaning fed from Kellhus' mind to the mouth of his hundreds.

And because your crazy inspires my own:

Wonder if mundane men could be used to anchor meaning with utterals? More likely, a chorus of school(wo)men all singing  ONE cant, with dozens of utteral/inutterals creating insane magic.

HOLYSHIT

^ this is how a body gets rid of a goddamn ark!!!

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« Reply #29 on: May 08, 2014, 06:35:53 pm »
Eleazarus and Iyokus definitely talk about "Concerts" in TWP.
Concerts, yes, but I always imagined that each was singing their own song. More like a collection of individuals. I'm talking about squads of schoolmen bent to singing the same song.
I imagine a SS concert consisting of dragon heads, kamakazi fire sparrows, etc. A combination of individual spells. I was thinking more along the lines of, to stick with this example, all of them singing to create a single enormous dragon.

I get you - and they were also talking about Concerts of Cishaurim. We really don't know enough to distinguish.
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