Crazy Ass Speculation Thread

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Wilshire

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« Reply #15 on: November 11, 2014, 04:24:30 am »
This isn't actually my theory.  My mother pitched this one to me.
A mother reading TSA is fascinating speculation. Could it be true? ...

The Ansurimbor to come in the Celmonan prophecy will actually be..

Ansurimbor Mimara
I'll never understand the continued fascination with this. The world is ending, we know this, the prophecy has done been fulfilled. Who the Anasurimbor was is largely irrelevant at this point, at least in regard to the prophecy... Isn't it?

Bakker will break the 4th wall in TUC and spend 400 pages writing about what it's like to be a writer
The way was too short. The journey broke him, returning him a madman.

The original Dunyain were all killed off shortly after arriving at Ishual.  They were replaced by a crowd of rebellious runaway tekne products, the precursors of what would eventually become skin-spies.
Smells like Chapterhouse: Dune. I can dig it.

2.  Would be funny if the Arc is also time-looped entity an was built from it's own lifeless carcass. That explains why Earwa is a promised land in the end Inchoroi led their dying ship back to the shipyard.
They have traveled so far and so long, they forgot why Earwa was the promised land. It was the world they originally left, eons ago (or perhaps haven't yet left, depending on time traveling ridiculousness).
One of the other conditions of possibility.

Phallus Pendulus

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« Reply #16 on: November 11, 2014, 02:59:08 pm »
This isn't actually my theory.  My mother pitched this one to me.
A mother reading TSA is fascinating speculation. Could it be true?

What do you mean, it's weird? I re-enact the Ikurei Xerius chapters with my mother every weekend.

Wilshire

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« Reply #17 on: November 11, 2014, 03:12:37 pm »
Every time I see the title, force of habit changes where the hyphen should be. Instead of Crazy-Ass speculation, Crazy Ass-speculation.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

Ozark

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« Reply #18 on: November 14, 2014, 01:55:55 am »
While we're on Crazy Biblical/Messianic Speculation, let's do Kellhus vs. Simon Magus

Simon Magus is a foreigner among the Jews      Kellhus is a foreigner among the Inrithi

Simon Magus is a sorcerer                               Kellhus is a sorcerer

Simon Magus is instructed by Simon Peter        Kellhus is instructed in the "Gnosis" by Akka (note he is now Simon Peter analogue)
in healing thru the Holy Spirit

Simon Magus claims to have been crucified,     Kellhus is circumfixed, and may have survived by supernatural means
but survived by supernatural means

Simon Magus arouses controversy by marrying Kellhus does just the same
a whore.

Simon Magus is condemned by Simon Peter      Kellhus is condemned by Akka

Simon magus creates a highly elaborate form    Kellhus creates the meta-gnosis
of Gnostic religion

Simon Magus proclaims equality of the sexes     Kellhus creates female schools of sorcery

Simon Magus declares himself essentially a god  Ditto Kellhus

Simon Magus has a statue of himself                Kellhus becomes emperor
erected in the imperial capitol


Later, Simon Magus (Kellhus) is eventually defeated by Simon Peter (Akka) in what essentially amounts to a wizard's dual.

The Jesus similarities are a smokescreen for Kellhus being another Simon Magus, aka false messiah.


Wilshire

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« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2014, 04:32:23 am »
Seems like the classic tale of a prophet then.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

Ozark

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« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2014, 12:10:37 am »
Seems like the classic tale of a prophet then.

Absolutely not!  With all due respect of course.

The archetype of the prophet who marries a whore is of course Hosea, who only symbolically did this to prove a point, and did not presumably consummate the relationship.  For someone to openly do such a thing has only one precursor (Magus) unless you are a Dan Brown fan.

It seems fairly straightforward to me that the narrative is very up front with Christ imagery, but upon further examination Kellhus bears a far greater resemblance to Simon Magus.  I'm sorry to say, no one else even remotely fits the bill.

The question is - how familiar is Bakker with our sources on Magus - from canonical Acts of the Apostles, to apocryphal acts, to the clementine literature and homilies, - I even wonder how familiar he might be with Hellenistic romantic fiction and the recurring motif of false death and crucifixion survival.

This is a "crazy speculation" thread, after all, but I'd be curious to know what Bakker knows about Simon Magus, or even perhaps the Tubingen school of radical critics who associated him with Pauline non-Torah based Christianity.


Wilshire

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« Reply #21 on: November 15, 2014, 03:42:47 am »
Considering what the google machine turns up when I google Magus, him starting the gnostic religion and all the things you said. Seems to fit the bill. But, to me, it seems like an obscure connection.

I don't see much difference between they Christ guy and the Magus guy.

Any other prophets from other religions that fit the bill as well? If there are 2, there must be more. Dune's many prophets come to mind.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

MalapertGlim

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« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2014, 08:05:30 pm »
Every time I see the title, force of habit changes where the hyphen should be. Instead of Crazy-Ass speculation, Crazy Ass-speculation.

 :o :-[ :'(

---------------

Ozark, that is crazy interesting!

MalapertGlim

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« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2014, 09:34:22 pm »
- Nau-Cayuti is Nil'giccas' son

- Aurax has been replace with an Inchoroi skin-spy

- The Mimaran prophecy specifically states that a pregnant woman with the gift of the few will follow a demon-possessed man into the wastes.  That man is ... Achamian!  The pov that the reader is exposed to really is Achamian's pov, but he is entirely unaware that all of his thoughts and actions are controlled by a ciphrang hiding behind the wizard's soul.  This demon is bent on sewing discord in the world.  Zioz never left Earwa!

Francis Buck

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« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2014, 02:38:28 am »
- The Mimaran prophecy specifically states that a pregnant woman with the gift of the few will follow a demon-possessed man into the wastes.  That man is ... Achamian!  The pov that the reader is exposed to really is Achamian's pov, but he is entirely unaware that all of his thoughts and actions are controlled by a ciphrang hiding behind the wizard's soul.  This demon is bent on sewing discord in the world.  Zioz never left Earwa!

Wait, where was this Mimara prophecy detailed? I don't recall it...

Regardless, to put a twist on your theory: Achamian is the possesed person, but it's not a Ciphrang that's possessing him. It's Seswatha.

Wilshire

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« Reply #25 on: November 17, 2014, 03:22:06 pm »
"Mimaran Prophecy" lol. Yes, MG, were did you find that. Lost page on the Sagas or something?
One of the other conditions of possibility.

MalapertGlim

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« Reply #26 on: November 17, 2014, 03:59:11 pm »
- The Mimaran prophecy specifically states that a pregnant woman with the gift of the few will follow a demon-possessed man into the wastes.  That man is ... Achamian!  The pov that the reader is exposed to really is Achamian's pov, but he is entirely unaware that all of his thoughts and actions are controlled by a ciphrang hiding behind the wizard's soul.  This demon is bent on sewing discord in the world.  Zioz never left



Wait, where was this Mimara prophecy detailed? I don't recall it...

Regardless, to put a twist on your theory: Achamian is the possesed person, but it's not a Ciphrang that's possessing him. It's Seswatha.

FB im just thinking of the convo between Aurang and the soma skinspy

MalapertGlim

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MalapertGlim

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« Reply #28 on: November 21, 2014, 02:13:07 am »
Carindusu was a skin-spy.  The Consult were already working on producing skin-spies with souls and producing skin-spies with normal human seeming musculature.  The entire Great Ordeal is infected with this new breed of skin-spy.  The consult had an old skin-spy attend the meeting of believer kings at the end of TJE to continue nurturing a confirmation bias in Kellhus.

profgrape

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« Reply #29 on: November 21, 2014, 10:56:13 pm »
Regardless, to put a twist on your theory: Achamian is the possesed person, but it's not a Ciphrang that's possessing him. It's Seswatha.
If true, it would certainly explain a few things.  The question is, does Kellhus know about the "possession"?