[TGO Spoilers] The Slog 2.0- TDTCB reread

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BeardFisher-King

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« Reply #15 on: February 20, 2017, 07:26:50 pm »
Did anyone on their very first read get the feeling that Akka was a pedophile or at least a guy with a sketchy past? I'm remembering my very first read thru and I thought he molested proyas, loved inrau, and loved esmi because he just not supposed to. I think one of my earliest post was asking if akka was a pedophile.

No, I never got that impression; I always considered Achamian completely hetero, given Esmenet's early appearance in the story. Akka's love for Inrau, IMHO, is textbook Platonic teacher/student relationship.

Don't all sorcerers in the Three Seas have sketchy pasts? And even sketchier futures?  :o
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« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2017, 02:34:04 pm »
Did anyone on their very first read get the feeling that Akka was a pedophile or at least a guy with a sketchy past? I'm remembering my very first read thru and I thought he molested proyas, loved inrau, and loved esmi because he just not supposed to. I think one of my earliest post was asking if akka was a pedophile.

No, I never got that impression; I always considered Achamian completely hetero, given Esmenet's early appearance in the story. Akka's love for Inrau, IMHO, is textbook Platonic teacher/student relationship.

Don't all sorcerers in the Three Seas have sketchy pasts? And even sketchier futures?  :o

I think he loves his students - platonic, as you said, he's just a caring person. Yes, seriously. Not everything in this book has to be dark and twisted lol.

That said, he was at least bi-curious  in his youth. There's a passage early on about him being in a relationship with his roommate earlier in his career as a sorcerer. Can't remember his name, but given that all sorcerers are men at this point, it must have been a man lol. I think he's even mentioned in one of the glossaries as Achamian's lover I think, and there is a couple sentences in one of the books about it as well.
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geoffrobro

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« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2017, 03:29:25 pm »
But at that time that was all I knew about Akka. All his students kinda ran away from him, his bosses don't fully trust him Cuz of shit he did in the past, and there has been at least 2 child molestations and I'm only like 5 chapters into this book. Lmao this is my out there thoughts on the very first read thru.
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Wilshire

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« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2017, 05:13:21 pm »
There is an argument there for sure, and its not the first time I've heard it from first time readers or veterans.
I'm just saying that's not what I saw on the first read or thereafter. *shrug*
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« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2017, 05:29:12 pm »
There is an argument there for sure, and its not the first time I've heard it from first time readers or veterans.
I'm just saying that's not what I saw on the first read or thereafter. *shrug*

So you are saying there is just something wrong with us?  ;)

It was definitely something I felt could have been the case on my first read, but subsequently never stood up to actual investigation, like most feelings in life.
“I am a warrior of ages, Anasûrimbor . . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury.” -Cet’ingira

Redeagl

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« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2017, 05:32:51 pm »
What I am sure of is that he is semi Bisexual, and he have a tendency of describing men especially boys from a sexual point of view. He also remarks on Esmenet "boyish" hair I think hence my own sucpecions.
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« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2017, 06:06:28 pm »
I'll put myself in the never thought anything more than "teacher/student love with Achamian and his students" camp.

I'd guess that the online culture surrounding the books and the modern culture disconnect from that kind of teacher/student interaction might bias readers though. In that kind of context, Achamian might have spent more time around Proyas than his parents and Inrau was the student that Achamian "saved" from the Mandate.
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MSJ

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« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2017, 08:45:15 pm »
I'll put myself in the never thought anything more than "teacher/student love with Achamian and his students" camp.

I'd guess that the online culture surrounding the books and the modern culture disconnect from that kind of teacher/student interaction might bias readers though. In that kind of context, Achamian might have spent more time around Proyas than his parents and Inrau was the student that Achamian "saved" from the Mandate.

This was same exact thoughts. Sorry for not keeping up on the Slog. I've been very busy at home. When the Slog reaches TGO, I will be more than happy to join in. Sorry Redeagl and all others participating. Just don't have time to read and dissect and be committed to posting at the moment.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2017, 10:17:06 pm by MSJ »
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

themerchant

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« Reply #23 on: February 26, 2017, 11:08:14 pm »
Did anyone on their very first read get the feeling that Akka was a pedophile or at least a guy with a sketchy past? I'm remembering my very first read thru and I thought he molested proyas, loved inrau, and loved esmi because he just not supposed to. I think one of my earliest post was asking if akka was a pedophile.

No, I never got that impression; I always considered Achamian completely hetero, given Esmenet's early appearance in the story. Akka's love for Inrau, IMHO, is textbook Platonic teacher/student relationship.

Don't all sorcerers in the Three Seas have sketchy pasts? And even sketchier futures?  :o

I think he loves his students - platonic, as you said, he's just a caring person. Yes, seriously. Not everything in this book has to be dark and twisted lol.

That said, he was at least bi-curious  in his youth. There's a passage early on about him being in a relationship with his roommate earlier in his career as a sorcerer. Can't remember his name, but given that all sorcerers are men at this point, it must have been a man lol. I think he's even mentioned in one of the glossaries as Achamian's lover I think, and there is a couple sentences in one of the books about it as well.

Yeah guys get choraed , it's his lover that makes the argument that only mandate give without hope of reward. They read that defence of the dark arts book together in the scene Akka remembers him.


MSJ

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« Reply #24 on: May 11, 2017, 01:27:42 pm »
So, I am about halfway through TDTCB, and I can't help but notice all the references to Shakers and Onkis. Is this a thematic choice for the book? Or, was Bakker starting something with Onkis only to drop it? I mean, as a goddess she could have a ton of implications in this series, but after TDTCB we rarely, if ever hear about her. So, I'm forced to believe its thematic.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2017, 01:29:53 pm by MSJ »
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

MSJ

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« Reply #25 on: May 16, 2017, 06:08:20 pm »
I want to know how and why Maithenet would know that Akka would be vital to Kellhus. Maithenet sends Proyas a letter wherein he tells him to aid the Mandate sorcerer Drusas Achamian. But, how did they know? Is this a clue that Moe knows that the principle of Before and After are false? That he went to the Outside and seen that Akka would become Kellhus's teacher?
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

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« Reply #26 on: May 16, 2017, 07:33:16 pm »
I want to know how and why Maithenet would know that Akka would be vital to Kellhus. Maithenet sends Proyas a letter wherein he tells him to aid the Mandate sorcerer Drusas Achamian. But, how did they know? Is this a clue that Moe knows that the principle of Before and After are false? That he went to the Outside and seen that Akka would become Kellhus's teacher?

Well, part of the Thought must factor in the Celmomian Prophecy.  As such, they must realize that part of making Kellhus "accepted" lies in getting the Mandate to believe he is the Harbinger.  As such, I think it would behoove to groom Akka for the role, which they do.
“I am a warrior of ages, Anasûrimbor . . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury.” -Cet’ingira

MSJ

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« Reply #27 on: May 16, 2017, 07:49:27 pm »
I want to know how and why Maithenet would know that Akka would be vital to Kellhus. Maithenet sends Proyas a letter wherein he tells him to aid the Mandate sorcerer Drusas Achamian. But, how did they know? Is this a clue that Moe knows that the principle of Before and After are false? That he went to the Outside and seen that Akka would become Kellhus's teacher?

Well, part of the Thought must factor in the Celmomian Prophecy.  As such, they must realize that part of making Kellhus "accepted" lies in getting the Mandate to believe he is the Harbinger.  As such, I think it would behoove to groom Akka for the role, which they do.

Right. But, how do they know this?
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

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« Reply #28 on: May 16, 2017, 07:56:23 pm »
Right. But, how do they know this?

Maith must have some little birds about, he probably knew that Akka was in the area.  In fact, if I remember correctly, Maith sees Akka and I believe he questions Proyas about him.  He presumably connects the dots, or Moe does, to realize what is the right course of action will be.
“I am a warrior of ages, Anasûrimbor . . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury.” -Cet’ingira

MSJ

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« Reply #29 on: May 16, 2017, 08:14:01 pm »
Maith must have some little birds about, he probably knew that Akka was in the area.  In fact, if I remember correctly, Maith sees Akka and I believe he questions Proyas about him.  He presumably connects the dots, or Moe does, to realize what is the right course of action will be.

He sees him at The Hagerna when declaring the object of the Holy War. But, it doesn't explain how he knows that Akka will teach him. Maybe its deduction, I guess.
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,