How grimdark is TDTCB?

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Hand of Yawgmoth

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« Reply #15 on: August 27, 2017, 11:22:12 pm »
Darkness that Comes Before is currently the most grimdark out of all the books up for voting with a 4.49! The only other book currently above a 4.0 is Prince of Thorns.

Just need to get Heroes Die into that poll! Love me some Caine :)

It's in the next round of voting, and I'll be disappointed if it doesn't break the 4.0 threshold.

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« Reply #16 on: August 28, 2017, 12:39:09 am »
Quote from:  tleilaxu
Grimdark seems to have some negative connotations for Bakker.

I don't see how you took that away at all. I took that he was referring to others who don't like whats in the "bag". His final statement seemed to suggest quite the opposite of what you took away.

Quote from: The RSB
I appreciate that some people don't like frightening and troubling things, but please... Don't blame the bag.

[EDIT Madness: Fixed quote tag.]
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 10:02:50 pm by Madness »
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Srancy

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« Reply #17 on: September 06, 2017, 12:35:36 am »
I actually find Earwa uplifting. At least there is the hope for Salvation in their world.

TaoHorror

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« Reply #18 on: September 06, 2017, 01:03:47 am »
I've never read Mark Lawrence's books, but I might give them a try based on this result. Oooh, he's suckered me in ;)

Dude, don't. Waste of your time - his story is "ok", but not a good writer.
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TaoHorror

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« Reply #19 on: September 06, 2017, 01:08:29 am »
Grimdark seems to have some negative connotations for Bakker.

As it should, seems to be a clumsy construct of having to categorize everything. I guess 2 words is too much ( i.e. Fantasy Horror ), so someone had to make a word up, thinking it was cool but quite the opposite, Grimdark is nerdy uncool ( the word, that is - not the works "falling into" this made up genre ).

I took "Grimdark" as a story where the protagonist/hero is evil.

So it appears, Beyond Redemption by Michael R Fletcher, beat it out. Not that I give a shit that anything did, but anyone know this book? Any good?
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 01:15:32 am by TaoHorror »
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themerchant

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« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2017, 04:59:17 am »
Just read a couple of reviews sounds interesting.

this bit of a review stuck out for mr personally

"This book is awesome. It takes a very familiar set up - the master thief, the swordsman, the old hand one last job from retirement - and then does.... crazy, crazy lovely things"

mostly.harmless

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« Reply #21 on: September 08, 2017, 07:57:02 pm »
I've read both books by Mr. Fletcher. I think the Grimdark level, for lack of a better word, is similar to PoN/tAE.

I liked the books a lot. He uses German names for ppl, objects, magical system and some other stuff. Knowing German it adds a layer to the story for me, but if you don't I guess the names are also just cool-sounding (my opinion) and looking them up can give you some 'ah-hah!' moments.

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Wilshire

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« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2017, 04:22:16 pm »
Lmao, I love this exchange in the comments:

Quote
Jimmy Poore8 September 2017 at 11:08
When are you going to draw a map for Book of the ancestors series? I'm dying to read Red Sister but can't bring myself to do it without a map.

Reply
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Mark Lawrence8 September 2017 at 11:40
I'm not going to. If you can't read a book without a map I guess it's not a book for you.


Jimmy Poore9 September 2017 at 06:11
A thousand other authors make reference material let alone a map for their fictional creations. Why would I bother to read one where the author can't be bothered? If people don't like it they don't have to look at it. I hear this talked about all the time, its good to have it for people who want it. It seems your alienating a bunch of people from reading your book especially with an attitude like that!


Mark Lawrence10 September 2017 at 06:59
Like I say: it sounds as if the book isn't for you. I'm sure you can find something else to read.
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Wilshire

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« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2017, 04:24:49 pm »
Also, Heroes Die is up there now.
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Redeagl

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« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2017, 05:02:04 pm »
Lmao, I love this exchange in the comments:

Quote
Jimmy Poore8 September 2017 at 11:08
When are you going to draw a map for Book of the ancestors series? I'm dying to read Red Sister but can't bring myself to do it without a map.

Reply
Replies

Mark Lawrence8 September 2017 at 11:40
I'm not going to. If you can't read a book without a map I guess it's not a book for you.


Jimmy Poore9 September 2017 at 06:11
A thousand other authors make reference material let alone a map for their fictional creations. Why would I bother to read one where the author can't be bothered? If people don't like it they don't have to look at it. I hear this talked about all the time, its good to have it for people who want it. It seems your alienating a bunch of people from reading your book especially with an attitude like that!


Mark Lawrence10 September 2017 at 06:59
Like I say: it sounds as if the book isn't for you. I'm sure you can find something else to read.

Hah. That's funny.
“The thoughts of all men arise from the darkness. If you are the movement of your soul, and the cause of that movement precedes you, then how could you ever call your thoughts your own? How could you be anything other than a slave to the darkness that comes before?”

- Chronicler of the Chroniclers

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« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2017, 12:33:47 am »
That actually got a really funny followup by him on facebook.
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« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2017, 11:03:59 am »
I've never read Mark Lawrence's books, but I might give them a try based on this result. Oooh, he's suckered me in ;)

Dude, don't. Waste of your time - his story is "ok", but not a good writer.

Noted ;)
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Yellow

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« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2017, 11:07:06 am »
Grimdark seems to have some negative connotations for Bakker.

As it should, seems to be a clumsy construct of having to categorize everything. I guess 2 words is too much ( i.e. Fantasy Horror ), so someone had to make a word up, thinking it was cool but quite the opposite, Grimdark is nerdy uncool ( the word, that is - not the works "falling into" this made up genre ).

I took "Grimdark" as a story where the protagonist/hero is evil.

So it appears, Beyond Redemption by Michael R Fletcher, beat it out. Not that I give a shit that anything did, but anyone know this book? Any good?

I always thought it was taken (sarcastically) from 40k... "In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war".

Though Games Workshop is far from what I would consider to be grimdark.
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TaoHorror

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« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2017, 05:45:31 pm »
Grimdark seems to have some negative connotations for Bakker.

As it should, seems to be a clumsy construct of having to categorize everything. I guess 2 words is too much ( i.e. Fantasy Horror ), so someone had to make a word up, thinking it was cool but quite the opposite, Grimdark is nerdy uncool ( the word, that is - not the works "falling into" this made up genre ).

I took "Grimdark" as a story where the protagonist/hero is evil.

So it appears, Beyond Redemption by Michael R Fletcher, beat it out. Not that I give a shit that anything did, but anyone know this book? Any good?

I always thought it was taken (sarcastically) from 40k... "In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war".

Though Games Workshop is far from what I would consider to be grimdark.

Ah, nice - I bet you're right, has to come from somewhere. Personally, I'm fine with very generic classifications, like sci-fi, fantasy or fantasy horror if you will. Dan Simmons pretty much came up with sci-fi horror, but haven't seen much since that measures up - but I'm not well read, so maybe plenty out there that does.
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« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2017, 06:52:59 pm »
I always thought it was taken (sarcastically) from 40k... "In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war".

As far as anyone can tell, that's where the nomenclature was sourced.

But I mean, in Abercrombie's interviews on the Grim Tidings podcast, he freely admits that he started his @LordGrimdark twitter account to "take the piss out of" (as they say) people calling his stuff Grimdark in the first place and inadvertently legitimized the sub-genre... so there's that ;).
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