Philosophers On The Art of Morally Troubling Artists

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Madness

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« on: November 24, 2017, 02:04:20 pm »
Philosophers On The Art of Morally Troubling Artists - six philosophers and one comedian tackle the title theme.
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TaoHorror

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« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2017, 02:04:13 am »
Philosophers On The Art of Morally Troubling Artists - six philosophers and one comedian tackle the title theme.

I haven't read much yet, but wanted to capture my initial response before allowing other intelligence to influence my initial position ( and  forget what it even was ). Our "work" is independent of our moral psychology ( I put it this way because I'm guessing - since I'm not like them, I can only guess - some, if not all of them, didn't "realize" they were doing anything "wrong" - of course, Bill Cosby did - but some of the harassment by others may not have been self evident ). I've encountered moral idiots produce incredible work, and the opposite and incredibly cool/great people produce excellence, and the permutations go on and on. Simply put, I have no problem still loving Bill Cosby's stand up routines ( never was much into his tv shows ) just as much as I always have and he can be sent directly to jail for his crimes. Maybe I've been influenced by "Evil is a matter of perspective" to allow for humans to show the world different "faces". It's not a question of morality to still like the art as you always have - just whether you think your "heroes" deserve a pass or elbow room negotiating morality or the law. I hesitate to give this much attention, I think most know it's completely fine to enjoy the old art ( and the new even ) of freshly revealed criminals as long as we don't provide special dispensation of justice. The BIG questions are how did it go on so long, what's it say about a lawyer knowingly representing a guilty person, etc.
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Wilshire

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« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2018, 01:23:28 pm »
TH, I guess the point of contention is supporting someone who is known to do nefarious things. If you knew, for example, that you enjoyment in the form of internet clicks, page views, netflix watches - which all translate into monetary compensation for the owner - does that bother you?

That separation is enough to justify one way or the other, but would it bother you if there was a direct connection - you walking up to said person and giving them money explicitly to fund their nefarious behaviors? I think a lot of people feel that that's exactly whats happening when you show support for past works.
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TaoHorror

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« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2018, 09:47:23 pm »
TH, I guess the point of contention is supporting someone who is known to do nefarious things. If you knew, for example, that you enjoyment in the form of internet clicks, page views, netflix watches - which all translate into monetary compensation for the owner - does that bother you?

That separation is enough to justify one way or the other, but would it bother you if there was a direct connection - you walking up to said person and giving them money explicitly to fund their nefarious behaviors? I think a lot of people feel that that's exactly whats happening when you show support for past works.

Ok, good, I mistook the point. I responded to "should you stop liking it", not "should you stop buying it". The best example I can think of is when OJ wrote his admission book and the world ( including myself ) told him to go fuck himself. If the presentation/offering is not illegal, then I think it's a private matter and doesn't really mean much for society one way or the other. Should criminals make money? Sure, if done legally. I guess I don't financially support said criminals, but made the decision unconsciously not to. Now that you bring it up, it's floated up to my eyes and now get the point. Cosby nor OJ hasn't received a dime of my money/attention since they were outed as criminals, best I can tell ( except I did see the very good tv show came out year+ ago about the trial - don't know if he received anything for that, I'm guessing he didn't - if he did, I confess that would suck ). This is a self resolving issue - I'm guessing sales for said criminals dropped off a cliff, therefore society has answered ... but to expand, I would be surprised if anyone would care if people still purchased product, it's a personal moral, not one that erodes society.
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themerchant

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« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2018, 10:03:09 pm »
To be fair i pay taxes to the UK government, so can't really quibble about buying for example "the dude's" books whoever the dude actually turns out to be,

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« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2018, 10:59:55 pm »
To be fair i pay taxes to the UK government, so can't really quibble about buying for example "the dude's" books whoever the dude actually turns out to be,

? ? ?
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« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2018, 01:56:12 pm »
I think themerchant is saying UK has a morally troubling government but yet he still pays taxes to them.
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TaoHorror

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« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2018, 02:42:52 pm »
I think themerchant is saying UK has a morally troubling government but yet he still pays taxes to them.

Not exactly an equivalency given paying taxes in unavoidable, but I see the point now, thanks.
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themerchant

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« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2018, 03:59:36 pm »
It's not unavoidable at all. It just can be very detrimental to you if you decide not too, as the state will just eventually use violence to get it. After putting on a pantomime of civilisation.

Basically i mean if you can pay taxes to a government that uses that money to do dodgy shit. I'm not suddenly going to bother about buying the dude that wrote enders game.