ARC: TDTCB Chapter 13

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TheCulminatingApe

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« on: July 02, 2018, 12:52:45 pm »
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Even the hard-hearted avoid the heat of desperate men.  For the bonfires of the weak crack the most stone.

CONRIYAN PROVERB

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So who were the heroes and cravens of the Holy War?  There are already songs enough to answer that question.  Needless to say, the Holy War provided further violent proof of Ajencis' old proverb, "Though all men be equally frail before the world, the differences between them are terrifying.

DRUSAS ACHAMIAN, COMPENDIUM OF THE FIRST HOLY WAR
Sez who?
Seswatha, that's who.

TheCulminatingApe

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« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2018, 06:51:03 pm »
Lots of interesting things in this Chapter.

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In desperate times, Cnaiur knew, men rationed nothing so jealously as tolerance.  They were more strict in their interpretation of custom and less forgiving of uncommon things
Echoes of the real world there.

We learn that the Scylvendi worship Lokung, who was born, and who laid waste to the north.  I don't think we have actually had any real mention of the No-God as yet, so the two can't necessarily be linked, but the implication seems to be that the Scylvendi are on the 'wrong' side religiously, as it were.

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What do you see?
We get this twice from Cnaiur in a short space of time as Kellhus is scrutinizing him.  This, I think, is the first appearance of one of the No-God's 'catchphrases'.  Also, the reference to Bannut links back to an earlier Chapter, where Cnaiur is told 'he will be measured'. 

Cnaiur decides he will kill Kellhus.  Cnaiur realises Kellhus will kill him.  Kellhus decides he will not kill Cnaiur.

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Scenarios flashed through his soul's eye: his strike stilled by Kellhus's bare palms; his strike stilled by the treachery of his own hand, Kellhus's eyes popping open, and a voice from nowhere saying I know you Scylvendi... better than any lover, any God.
  Cnaiur knows he is outmatched, I think.

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And why had he decided to cross the mountains?  Was it truly to discover whether the Empire was embroiled in a holy war, or was it to draw out the lie he had been chasing?
Use the son.  Use a Dunyain...
Such a fool!
He did not sleep that night. Neither did the wolves.  Before dawn he crept into the pitch black of a yaksh and huddled among weeds.  He found an infant's skull and wept, screamed at the bindings, at the wood, at the hide surfaces; he beat his fists against the treacherous earth beneath.
The wolves laughed and wailed despicable names.  Hateful names.
Afterward, he put his lips to the earth and breathed.  He could feel him listening from somewhere out there. He could feel him knowing.
What did he see?
It did not matter.  The fire burned and it had to be fed.
On lies if need be.
Because the fire burned true.  The fire alone.
So cold against swollen eyes.  The Steppe. The trackless Steppe.

Cnaiur destroys the Munuati. both in answer to their mockery and to prove the Scylvendi lost to superior intelligence at Kiyuth.  He knows the Scylvendi have been deceived, that the are slaves to custom, to 'what comes before'.  We also get an example of the seeming superhuman physical abilities of Anasurimbor Kellhus.

We come across Serwe for the first time.  From what seems to be a pretty innocent childhood, she falls into the hands of series of increasingly monstrous men, first her father (who sells her, seemingly without a moments thought), the House Gaunum, then the Munuati, then Cnaiur, and ultimately Kellhus (the kind of man who is feared by a Scylvendi.  Serwe prays, she wants justice.  She needs to be shown that she means something.

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Because she was Serwe and she was nothing.  She would always be nothing.
  and later in the same Chapter, Cnaiur describes Kellhus as
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A prince of nothing

But Kellhus is
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... only the promise.
Promise? she cried. Whose promise?
 
Promise of justice, redemption, salvation?  Promise of meaning?  Are we supposed to read Serwe experiences as representing all of Earwan womanhood?

Kellhus fights and defeats Cnaiur and dangles him of a cliff with one arm (surely physically impossible?). because
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He must be shown.
Kellhus misjudges the reflexes of Cnaiur, who draws blood, and misjudges how Cnaiur will react to the beating
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Yet more degradation for him to heap on the fire

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Everything depended on the domination of circumstance.  He would not join the Holy War, he would seize it, wield it as his instrument.
  This echoes Kellhus' internal thoughts from the prologue. 
« Last Edit: July 04, 2018, 06:54:15 pm by TheCulminatingApe »
Sez who?
Seswatha, that's who.

MSJ

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« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2018, 02:46:26 pm »
Quote from:  TheCulminatingApe
We learn that the Scylvendi worship Lokung, who was born, and who laid waste to the north.  I don't think we have actually had any real mention of the No-God as yet, so the two can't necessarily be linked, but the implication seems to be that the Scylvendi are on the 'wrong' side religiously, as it were.

Don't agree with this. The Scylvendi fought for the NG in the 1st apocalypse. They might not of knew it's name, but they worshipped it. Why? Because they are they People of War. And, that was the NG's purpose. They call it Lokung, The Dead God. They past this all down orally. They know the connection.
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

TheCulminatingApe

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« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2018, 08:15:23 pm »
Quote from:  TheCulminatingApe
We learn that the Scylvendi worship Lokung, who was born, and who laid waste to the north.  I don't think we have actually had any real mention of the No-God as yet, so the two can't necessarily be linked, but the implication seems to be that the Scylvendi are on the 'wrong' side religiously, as it were.

Don't agree with this. The Scylvendi fought for the NG in the 1st apocalypse. They might not of knew it's name, but they worshipped it. Why? Because they are they People of War. And, that was the NG's purpose. They call it Lokung, The Dead God. They past this all down orally. They know the connection.

I think you've misunderstood my post here, MSJ.  I wasn't saying the Scylvendi don't understand what 'Lokung' is, but that we as the readers don't yet have enough information to link the Scylvendi religion with the No-God.
Sez who?
Seswatha, that's who.

MSJ

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« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2018, 11:19:15 pm »
Quote from:  TheCulminatingApe
I think you've misunderstood my post here, MSJ.  I wasn't saying the Scylvendi don't understand what 'Lokung' is, but that we as the readers don't yet have enough information to link the Scylvendi religion with the No-God

Yes sir, I did misunderstand.  Sorry, I'm picking up what your putting down.
“No. I am your end. Before your eyes I will put your seed to the knife. I will quarter your carcass and feed it to the dogs. Your bones I will grind to dust and cast to the winds. I will strike down those who speak your name or the name of your fathers, until ‘Yursalka’ becomes as meaningless as infant babble. I will blot you out, hunt down your every trace! The track of your life has come to me,

TheCulminatingApe

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« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2018, 11:33:24 am »
Quote from:  TheCulminatingApe
I think you've misunderstood my post here, MSJ.  I wasn't saying the Scylvendi don't understand what 'Lokung' is, but that we as the readers don't yet have enough information to link the Scylvendi religion with the No-God

Yes sir, I did misunderstand.  Sorry, I'm picking up what your putting down.

No need to apologise :)
Sez who?
Seswatha, that's who.