Quya + Metagnosis

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« on: May 15, 2013, 12:21:34 am »
Quote from: sciborg2
Wilshire's post in the Akka power thread intrigues me and I wanted to make a separate topic for it.

What if Serwa teaches the Quya the Metagnosis? Then they teleport to Golgotterath.

This, of course, requires that there be some legitimately Intact Quya left.

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« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2013, 12:21:39 am »
Quote from: Madness
Personally, I think most of the Nonmen in Ishterebinth are, probably, Intact. However, I think that the revelation of Nil'giccas' lie in Injor-Niyas - speculation, obviously - probably would be enough to convince the Intact to join the Consult for entirely rational reasons.

I honestly wonder what innovations the Intact have made to their sorcery in their quest to stay sane.

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« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2013, 12:21:43 am »
Quote from: lockesnow
This is presuming the Intact are sorcerers rather than your run-of-the-mill Cunoroi.  Perhaps it is just the Quya who go insane.

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« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2013, 12:21:48 am »
Quote from: Madness
I think you mean it's just Non-Quya who go insane, yes? And yes, I'm assuming some Quya remain Intact.

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« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2013, 12:21:53 am »
Quote from: lockesnow
why?  the only erratics we've seen onscreen are quya.

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« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2013, 12:21:58 am »
Quote from: Curethan
I kinda imagine these 'intact' are non-men who've been locked in a room polishing stones or something to keep their memories from being overwritten.
Maybe they are actually kind of retarded.

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« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:03 am »
Quote from: Borque
Quote from: lockesnow
why?  the only erratics we've seen onscreen are quya.
I don't think Cinial'jin was Quya.

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« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:07 am »
Quote from: Wilshire
Quote from: Curethan
I kinda imagine these 'intact' are non-men who've been locked in a room polishing stones or something to keep their memories from being overwritten.
Maybe they are actually kind of retarded.

I have come to this conclusion myself. Perhaps they simply have been sitting in a room meditating for thousands of years. Though that is extremely lame and I hope it is not the case.

Back on topic though:

Though it had only occured to me just before I posted on the other thread, I'm glad someone was intrigued.

It seems that Kellhus needs some more allies, or at any rate, he needs the nonmen. He wouldn't have wasted ships full of men looking for them if he didn't. Now he could need them for several reasons. He may just need to ensure that they dont become enemies, or get in his way. He already has plenty of those, and have the nonmen on that list would certainly be bad.  This, or, he could need them as allies. I think this is more likely considering how hard he worked at contacting them, and also considering that he is going to take back their moribund outpost.

If he needs them as allies, then he would want them to be worth his time. I don't think he knows the state of their magic. I think that there is almost nothing known of the Quya by anyone, so it could be possible that Serwa is being sent to help them some. To teach them the Metagnosis perhaps? I certainly hope so, but that would take time. Something that the Ordeal has less of than anything else it seems. So maybe just a quick lesson on how to make some big explosions (they already have those nifty chariots so they dont need to teleport i dont think).

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« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:13 am »
Quote from: Charamemas
Quote from: Wilshire
Quote from: Curethan
I kinda imagine these 'intact' are non-men who've been locked in a room polishing stones or something to keep their memories from being overwritten.
Maybe they are actually kind of retarded.

I have come to this conclusion myself. Perhaps they simply have been sitting in a room meditating for thousands of years. Though that is extremely lame and I hope it is not the case.

Meditation does interesting things for the Dunyain ("The logos is without beginning or end"). Where would a Non-Man be after two millennia of such discipline? I want to see the result, even if it is a one-off.


Quote
Back on topic though:

Though it had only occured to me just before I posted on the other thread, I'm glad someone was intrigued.

It seems that Kellhus needs some more allies, or at any rate, he needs the nonmen. He wouldn't have wasted ships full of men looking for them if he didn't.

Kellhus, more than anything else, needs information about the No-God and the process of summoning him. Barring Maithanet and Papa Moe, who are both dead now, no one in the Three Seas has working knowledge of the Inchoroi and their intentions apart from the Mandate, and the impression we are given from the books is that the Mandate knows less than one might think, especially about the things that really matter. If Kellhus can make the summoning impossible (for instance, by killing one of both of the Inchoroi) then the Consult are defeated in principle, even if they will still be able to hide out and be immortal and depraved in the far north. But who has this information? The Non-Men are easily the best source of knowledge apart from Consult members themselves (who will be damnably difficult to subvert, haha see what I did there).

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« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:19 am »
Quote from: Madness
I wish the old Three-Seas was accessible for moments like these.

Bakker's quote about the Nonmen was that they'd spent these millenia looking for any means, sorcerous or otherwise, to forestall their cognitive decline.

I wouldn't be disappointed if the Nonmen were polishing stones or meditating. Hell, I can even envision something like a DBZ's Hyperbolic Time Chamber.

It's the sorcerous or otherwise that implies to me that Quya aren't all powerful in Nonmen society like they'd seem in Earwan society without the social constraint of Chorae. I'd think Ishroi would also have a chance at remaining Intact, neh?

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« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:23 am »
Quote from: Wilshire
DBZ's hyperbolic Time Chamber, sir, made the occupants experiences a years worth of time inside while a week past in regular time. (fuzzy one the week, might have been less). Something like that would only make matters worse.

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« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:28 am »
Quote from: Madness
Oh Wilshire, a simple inversion be all we need.

How about a sorcerous chamber where a day passing, is years outside?

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« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:33 am »
Quote from: Wilshire
haha i know, just wanted to point out how much of a nerd i am. that is all.
im sure the opposite could work out just fine, though it would probably require many sorcerers to maintain that kind of no-time field.

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« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:38 am »
Quote from: Madness
Hmm... No-time field. Damn you, Wilshire lol. Where are you at with the series? Done Heretics?

Dune:
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« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2013, 12:22:43 am »
Quote from: Wilshire
completely off topic but:
I stopped after chapterhouse, though the ending was infuriating and I'll get around to the others at some point. I just read the first hitchhicker's guide since I figured it was about time I did, and now im reading Perdido Street Station by China Mieville. That book if going to be brutal.