Kellhus: good or evil?

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Bolivar

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« Reply #135 on: July 27, 2015, 08:19:19 pm »
I would hope TSTSNBN is more than an epilogue, the second Trilogy feels like it's been all build up to me.

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MrGanondorf

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« Reply #136 on: October 11, 2015, 05:58:04 pm »
Quote from: Bakker Interview
The defining thematic moment in my endless rewriting came when I realized that I could turn the ‘man the meaning maker’ paradigm upside down, tell the story of a protagonist struggling to bring meaninglessness to an objectively meaningful world.

So, Kellhus as protagonist?  So, to revisit my earlier theorem, Kellhus saves the world and destroys meaning at the same time?

i'm not sure a person could 'save' the world without meaning...

if Kellhus is saving the world, then i think it would be to reorder the meaning of the world so that the only arbitrary meaning is the foundation and all other meanings derive from the single foundation.  it could be a self-sacrifice: Kellhus intends to become god, fully exposing himself to the meaninglessness of everything, while shielding everyone else from it.  Kellhus becomes the Meaning that all other meanings hang on

this would fit with the theme that Moe had Kellhus broken on the Circumfix in just a way that Kellhus became convinced of at least 1 kind of meaningful proposition (like "the world is worth saving" or "Serwe is worth saving")

so i wonder what the Puppet Master has in mind for Kellhus...what purpose it serves for Moe for Kellhus to be the Sacrificial Lamb

MrGanondorf

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« Reply #137 on: February 07, 2016, 08:19:28 pm »
From 340 TTT US paperback

"'The God,' Kellhus said.  'He doesn't speak to you?'"

I guess I never thought it through, but Kellhus' 'madness' is characterized by messages from the God and the No-God (if he is to be believed).  Thinking back on the conversation, Kellhus vs Aurang/Esmi, Aurang's reaction to Kellhus' assertion that Kellhus hears the No-God is curious.  It's at least possible that Aurang isn't faking his terror.  Ergo Aurang thinks it is possible for Mog to talk to Kellhus.  Ergo, it might actually be possible.  I had simply assumed that Kellhus was telling a convenient lie, but he could be getting dreams from Mog all the time for all I know.

Another possibility: Kellhus is aware that his dad tried to manipulate him by sending visions of Mog while Kellhus hung on the circumfix.  To throw his dad off, Kellhus acts like Moe unintentionally overexerted Kellhus, so that Kellhus was pushed past the manufactured madness of having visions of the No-God to full on clinical insanity of hearing from God too.

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« Reply #138 on: February 07, 2016, 08:50:39 pm »
I can't remember exactly what it was that Bakker said about Kellhus being the guy who brings meaninglessness to a meaningful world, but I was thinking about that I wonder if we could be more precise.  The exact thing that deflates meaning from both Earwa and Earth is Darwinianism.  Not trying to, um, denigrate Darwin or anything, but evolution via natural selection drains away a lot of 'magic.'  Once there was God, now there is tribal custom that helps perpetuate the tribe.  Once there was magic, now there is the optimism that you can manipulate the world in your favor, a trait that survivors have and pass on.  Once there was goodness, now there are norms that provide for group cohesion.  What what?