My spoil it all prediction for what the overall setting is

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Callan S.

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« on: August 07, 2013, 02:08:47 am »
My overall prediction is that the genre will literally leap from fantasy to sci-fi.

That the world is actually far future - that various technological societies developed the means to cast a sort of damnation internet not just across a world, no just across many worlds, but across whole milky ways. They thought this mechanism would make everything 'right'. Possibly the one god is a super computer. They set up some sort of hippy-esque low technology life on the planet we know as Earwa, which is actually nestled amongst their frightening cthulu-tech damnation internet.

Then eventually some sort of catasrophe occured where the humans on earwa were nearly wiped out. The remaining ones, out of denial mostly, simply didn't teach new generations about the past. Thus it was forgotten. With the Inchoroi are actually another branch of human beings (originally) - though a quite widely distributed, given how long it took them to find Earwa.

But yeah, not a twist on ye old days, but instead its sci fi, dragged down to the genre of fantasy by the pure force of fictional events and the qualities of forgetting.

I was already surprised about having space aliens in fantasy - with that, this doesn't seem so implausible to me.

locke

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« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2013, 05:39:57 pm »
I wouldn't be surprised at any of that.  It's similar enough to Dune.  In fact, you could almost argue that the series is in response to the question posed by the end of the final Dune novel, wtf are the honored matres running from?

Somnambulist

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« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2013, 12:41:29 pm »
Clarke's Third Law:  Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Why not?  Though now I've got this uncomfortable association forming with The Matrix.  Kellhus = Neo?  :)
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Callan S.

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« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2013, 01:19:57 am »
Sufficiently advanced sci-fi is indistinguishable from fantasy.

I'd liken Kellhus more to agent Smith. Particularly in regard the self duplication of the latter movies (the thousand fold thought...one thought, rerendered a thousand times over? Cloud computing, man...)

Somnambulist

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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2013, 03:28:53 am »
Touché
No whistling on the slog!

Wilshire

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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2013, 08:38:23 pm »
Sufficiently advanced sci-fi is indistinguishable from fantasy.


That is awesome. I'm writing that down and putting it somewhere so that I won't forget it.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

Madness

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« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2013, 02:15:46 pm »
Lol.

+1 for Quotes, Somnambulist.

I wouldn't be surprised at any of that.  It's similar enough to Dune.  In fact, you could almost argue that the series is in response to the question posed by the end of the final Dune novel, wtf are the honored matres running from?

+1 for Something Worse than Inchoroi.
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Baztek

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« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2013, 08:36:56 pm »
I'm all for the inchoroi being the descendants of humans/human-like species. Totally bracing for a Planet of the Apes-esque moment in TUC when Kellhus or whoever braves the depths of Golgotterath and finds stylized depictions of a curious blue planet or some shit.

Callan S.

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« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2013, 02:25:20 am »
Probably makes the non men the genetically modified transhumans of humanity - whether they brought humans with them forceably or regular humans came along and then the relationship fell into what we see in the current timeline, who knows?

Reminds me of how Eskimo's used to think they were the only people in the whole world - till some dude came and stole their meteorite metal. And their children.

Francis Buck

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« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2013, 10:27:07 pm »
Man, I sure hope it's not going that way, considering I've been writing a novel for almost a year with almost the exact same premise (epic fantasy that turns out to be totally science-fiction).

Well, not exactly the same. No damnation or gods or what have you. But the whole "religious people not passing knowledge through the generations" thing is there. Everything that appears magical is in-fact based in science (futuristic science, anyway). And it was all done by transhumans. Obviously there's hell of a lot more to it than that, but yeah.

I've never even considered the possibility that Bakker's story might be going in the same direction. It certainly is possible, though there would be a lot that needs explaining. Why would the cultures have developed in such similar ways to past human society? And the distribution of the races with such similar religious and cultural backgrounds (in the broad sense)? Unless everything was being "guided" to go that way by the God or something, it would be an absolutely massive coincidence.

Madness

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« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2013, 01:54:43 pm »
I've never even considered the possibility that Bakker's story might be going in the same direction. It certainly is possible, though there would be a lot that needs explaining. Why would the cultures have developed in such similar ways to past human society? And the distribution of the races with such similar religious and cultural backgrounds (in the broad sense)? Unless everything was being "guided" to go that way by the God or something, it would be an absolutely massive coincidence.

I've often thought I'd 'figured Bakker' in the past number of years... He's always surprised me. Though, you can see me for MONTHS harping on Zombie Three-Seas about Achamian going to Ishterebinth.
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Baztek

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« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2013, 07:03:55 pm »
I'm kind of a book snob but even I'll admit the complexity of TSA is staggering. And a lot of that has to do with the particular lens of interpretation you guys see Bakker through. For me, this forum has enriched what is an already fascinatingly complex story into something beautiful and truly literary. Maybe the prose* isn't necessarily on par with Ulysses or Grapes of Wrath but the kind of academic clout you guys bring the table really helps it transcend its genre.

I'd love to pick your brains about some of my other favorite authors.

*in the first trilogy. The second trilogy is a whole other beast so far. Dude really hit his stride. Bakker is ferociously readable.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2013, 07:07:31 pm by Baztek »

Callan S.

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« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2013, 10:30:07 am »
Why would the cultures have developed in such similar ways to past human society? And the distribution of the races with such similar religious and cultural backgrounds (in the broad sense)?
Because they are using the same brain we all had back in the stone age and even before that? We are number sticks, yet in the end we fall in the same ways...

Madness

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« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2013, 01:20:07 pm »
I'm kind of a book snob but even I'll admit the complexity of TSA is staggering. And a lot of that has to do with the particular lens of interpretation you guys see Bakker through. For me, this forum has enriched what is an already fascinatingly complex story into something beautiful and truly literary. Maybe the prose* isn't necessarily on par with Ulysses or Grapes of Wrath but the kind of academic clout you guys bring the table really helps it transcend its genre.

I'd love to pick your brains about some of my other favorite authors.

*in the first trilogy. The second trilogy is a whole other beast so far. Dude really hit his stride. Bakker is ferociously readable.

+1 for you and +1 for your Avatar. I'm midway through Season 2 for the first time ever, though I had roommates who watched it religiously.
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Francis Buck

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« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2013, 05:28:23 pm »
Why would the cultures have developed in such similar ways to past human society? And the distribution of the races with such similar religious and cultural backgrounds (in the broad sense)?
Because they are using the same brain we all had back in the stone age and even before that? We are number sticks, yet in the end we fall in the same ways...

That logic only really works if the conditions are identical or very, very, similar, which I would say is not the case with Earwa. It's a world with magic, inhuman races of equal or greater intelligence, and well-known existential threats. I mean we're talking really direct parallels here. The Circumfix? Obviously Earwa and Earth are different, but the similarities are a bit too much for me to take that idea seriously. I'd be really disappointed if that was Bakker's explanation, and I'm not just saying that because of my own story (honestly I couldn't care less in that regard, I was more just being silly earlier; the actual story I'm telling and the world it takes place in are extremely different from the style of Earwa, they just happen to share the core twist you mentioned).
« Last Edit: August 23, 2013, 05:55:06 pm by Francis Buck »