[mrganondorf]

have we talked about the poop yet?  i'm not sure, but would an all meat diet make you really constipated eventually? something like that in the life of pi???

wonder what the properties of poop from consumed sranc would have for crops

while we're at it, the sranc might not leave their bodies behind what with cannibalizing their own, but the buttmud of millions of these things is going to be hard on the great ordeal's boots--and it's always right in front of their path, no matter which way they turn; poop and earth gouged for worms and such

[Wilshire]

The Inchoroi wanted to preserve the world. Maybe sranc droppings are actually extremely effective fertilizer.

[mrganondorf]

and peepee too!

[dragharrow]

Hey guys, whats up?

Hope I’m not too late for this topic. I want to jump in on the debate over metaphysics in Earwa and also the Kellhus is deluded thing.

First, I'm trying to get a handle on what you guys are arguing about related to metaphysics.

… In our world, we can speak of 'metaphysics' as something dealing with the soul that we don't believe in except as a metaphor, contrasted with the biological mechanism that is the body and the mind it fools itself into thinking it possesses. To the characters in tSA, though, there's no distinction, just as there wasn't to our own ancestors (and this is the point I think Bakker is trying to make throughout the series). In a sense, there's no such thing as 'metaphysics' to Earwans; it's all just 'physics'. The soul and sorcery and life after death are as real to them as rocks and trees and human bodies. Analysing Earwa from a 21st century scientific-materialist perspective is, IMO, a fundamental error.

But metaphysics is a thing to some Earwans. And the same goes for our ancestors.

Look at the philosophers of Earwa. Ajencis, for example, wrote books called The Commerce of Souls, Meta-analytics, and Theophysics. It seems very clear that those three books would all at least touch on metaphysical inquiry.

If Ajencis can analyze the metaphysics of Earwa then can’t we do that same?

The soul and sorcery and life after death are as real to them as rocks and trees and human bodies. Analysing Earwa from a 21st century scientific-materialist perspective is, IMO, a fundamental error.

Your implication is that the distinction between the two is a directly connected with our frame or even that metaphysics itself is a product of our frame. Metaphysics is not a product of the scientific-materialist frame. It is within the domain of the philosophical frame. How can you even have physics without the possibility of metaphysics?

[dragharrow]

Ok, so I was trying to write more but when I went back to reread posts I kept getting super confused.

I’m having trouble parsing out your usages of the term metaphysical. You disagree on the specific implications of the term but you all seem to be using the term in similar ways. From what I gather, you are using the word metaphysics to refer to something along the lines of the “the nature of the spiritual”. Am I interpreting you correctly? If so, I think that is way too narrow of a definition. I’ve only ever heard the term used to refer to the philosophical domain called metaphysics: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphysics

In philosophy metaphysics is not the mechanics of the non-physical/spiritual specifically. Its more like the mechanics of the pre-physical. It is interested in the nature of the most fundamental features of reality. What is the ultimate nature of reality? What is it like? Why?

So the metaphysics of Earwa do define the mechanics of the spiritual but its broader than that. Together, all of the first order laws that govern the reality of Earwa make up the metaphysical system of Earwa.

Is the way you guys use the term the common meaning of it here?

[locke]

Most people use metaphysical in the former way not the latter.  I had some philosophy classes but they didnt delve into metaphysics in the traditional sense.  I only grok what youre saying about metaphysics because we talked about schelling and naturphilosophie in a history of  biology class.

All typ0s courtesy of Samsung.

[mrganondorf]

drahharrow! i think i'm missing something! is this metaphysics + sranc meat something something?

[Wilshire]

Most people use metaphysical in the former way not the latter. 

Its a terminology that has arisen around here after some month/years of speculation and conversation. Its likely not "technically" correct, but this is what its used .

[dragharrow]

drahharrow! i think i'm missing something! is this metaphysics + sranc meat something something?

I got lost in semantics so I never really said anything of note. I'll try and fix what I was going to say though at some point.

[geoint]

At what point in the journey is this? IIRC I chalked that up to people, lots of people, surrendering their rations to him.. but I don't remember when that scene took place. Also, its possible Esmi was both delusional from malnutrition deluded by Kellhus' "greatness".

But he would not be above eating people... gross. Maybe eating people has strange metaphysical side effects.

Violation of the second law!

Hey if it means everybody in the GO is now immortal, everybody wins.  Except the Consult, and the sranc.  Those poor sranc.  They thought they had it bad before?

I like Abercrombie's books.


Forgot which page it was on, but the guy who said, 'men who fuck sranc' made me LOL in real life.  Good stuff

[Wilshire]

Forgot which page it was on, but the guy who said, 'men who fuck sranc' made me LOL in real life.  Good stuff

Cut from them their genitals, for they makes pits of their seed.

[mrganondorf]

At what point in the journey is this? IIRC I chalked that up to people, lots of people, surrendering their rations to him.. but I don't remember when that scene took place. Also, its possible Esmi was both delusional from malnutrition deluded by Kellhus' "greatness".

But he would not be above eating people... gross. Maybe eating people has strange metaphysical side effects.

Violation of the second law!

Hey if it means everybody in the GO is now immortal, everybody wins.  Except the Consult, and the sranc.  Those poor sranc.  They thought they had it bad before?

I like Abercrombie's books.


Forgot which page it was on, but the guy who said, 'men who fuck sranc' made me LOL in real life.  Good stuff

woah, eating sranc lenghtens your life like a nonman?  interesting!  maybe we'll get a story from Proyas like 200 years later telling his great-great-great-greats what really happened when the Great Ordeal reached the Ark

[Francis Buck]

I still stand by my idea that eating Sranc will similar but short-term effects to Qirri, possibly even stronger than Qirri, with much worse long-term effects.

[SilentRoamer]

I wonder if Sranc a la Carte was always the intended menu for the Great Ordeal. I think maybe so.

[SilentRoamer]

In fact scrap that - he definetely planned it. Shady Kellhus probably had the numbers nailed to exactly the critical point.

Definetely something interesting and probably awful will happen.