46
The Unholy Consult / Re: So...where do we go from here...? (Post TUC questions and thoughts)
« on: August 03, 2017, 10:19:07 pm »
The world saved by a cuddle session
Show Posts
This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.
47
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Seven Revelations of SuJuroit (Kellhus and Ajokli)
« on: August 03, 2017, 06:50:06 pm »QuotePoint 7: I think Kellhus's goal basically became a variant of Ajokli's goal. Escape damnation by becoming a prince of Hell. So he'd be the one doing the damning and feasting. Unfortunately for him Ajokli is way ahead of him and always was, because of both of their natures. I think Ajokli can't find Kellhus because right now, the Ajokli we see at the very end, is in the world, and cut off from the Outside by the No-God. Kellhus is in the Outside, so no Kellhus to be found.
One, sorrry for forgetting who im quoting here. But, the Outside is not shut. Far from it, not even close. Its not shut till pop. goes beneath 144,000 and maybe not even then.
Im down and always have been with Kellhus in the Outside and having mastered the Diamos, having a hiding space. Trting to transform the Outside, defeat the Gods, no more soul munching. It just doesnt seem likely or even be explored. And, hoping and believing humanity can lull off killing the No-God....again.
We already know that's impossible from the very existence of the Gods in the first place. They always-already are what they are, we have to get out of the habit of thinking these things temporally, as if Kellhus can now go to the Outside and start working his magic. If Kellhus had conquered the Outside, there wouldn't be any soul-munching to speak of, it always happened.
Unless we hit some random year and poof, damnation never existed, all this shit never existed, and Earwa is thoroughly disenchanted.
48
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Seven Revelations of SuJuroit (Kellhus and Ajokli)
« on: August 03, 2017, 06:00:23 pm »Moenghus did actually seemed saddened at considering that Kellhus had gone mad, and admitted he hadn't actually considered the possibility before the moment of meeting. Objectively, he should have.An idea I've had a couple of times goes like this:That would make sense except while Kellhus seems merely to channel Ajokli in the golden room, Cnaiür actually becomes Ajokli at the very end. I think Cnaiür is larval Ajokli. Kellhus was just instrumental in his temporal creation of himself. Not sure if that's always how it happens though, or if this kind of apotheosis is unique toe Ajokli.
People can become Ciphrangs (Cnaiur, etc.)
Gods are Ciphrangs (maybe...)
Ergo, at some point in the span of history, there live humans who will become Gods. (Note that, because of atemporality, the God self and the human self of these people exist at the same time)
Kellhus IS Ajokli's egg form. He is the wickedest, smartest person who will ever live, and he becomes Ajokli. Ajokli can't find him because he IS him. He doesn't know it because the No-God's servants were intimately involved in his linear self's death, so his atemporal self can't see it.
It makes sense Cnauir is larval Ajokli but dude would never make a pact with the sole reason for his hatred, eternal being or no. Or maybe he needs to to bootstrap himself into existence? I swear Finnegans Wake is easier to parse than this shit.
49
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Seven Revelations of SuJuroit (Kellhus and Ajokli)
« on: August 03, 2017, 04:03:08 pm »
So Kellhus made a deal with Ajokli to keep the granary open by helping him get rid of the Consult, arguably the enemy mankind can see. Whole loooootta resources devoted to stopping the lesser evil, idgi.
50
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Seven Revelations of SuJuroit (Kellhus and Ajokli)
« on: August 03, 2017, 03:39:18 pm »I don't see how those words are un-Kellhus like. Could easily be either or both of them speaking, to me.So Kellhus needed Ajokli to get a leg up on the Consult to stop Resumption, great, but what was his endgame after that? Nigga you just struck a pact with the universe's Satan, the world is still open to the Gods, what're ya gonna do now? I don't get it.I think he believed with sufficient mastery of the Daimos he could usurp Ajokli. He was very wrong.
Makes a bit more sense, but Kellhus trying to become a God in the Outside is very unlike him - he's supposed to be an AI, what does he care about power and desire? He arguably has no hunger to even act on. I get it's a way of avoiding damnation, but why not ally with the Consult and destroy them when they're no longer expedient?
51
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] The Seven Revelations of SuJuroit (Kellhus and Ajokli)
« on: August 03, 2017, 03:22:54 pm »
Two things:
It's precisely because the Gods see a block universe that the No-God succeeds (even Kellhus says the Inchoroi eventually win) - what's "outside" the block is Resumption. If the No-God is a "void" in the block, Resumption is the "space" around the block - ie, a disenchanted universe.
I'm pretty sure Kellhus seeing himself as a hunger in the Outside is just Ajokli speaking. Even before he enters the Golden Room Kellhus/Ajokli says "I am the master here", so Ajokli was manifesting from the start.
So Kellhus needed Ajokli to get a leg up on the Consult to stop Resumption, great, but what was his endgame after that? Nigga you just struck a pact with the universe's Satan, the world is still open to the Gods, what're ya gonna do now? I don't get it.
It's precisely because the Gods see a block universe that the No-God succeeds (even Kellhus says the Inchoroi eventually win) - what's "outside" the block is Resumption. If the No-God is a "void" in the block, Resumption is the "space" around the block - ie, a disenchanted universe.
I'm pretty sure Kellhus seeing himself as a hunger in the Outside is just Ajokli speaking. Even before he enters the Golden Room Kellhus/Ajokli says "I am the master here", so Ajokli was manifesting from the start.
So Kellhus needed Ajokli to get a leg up on the Consult to stop Resumption, great, but what was his endgame after that? Nigga you just struck a pact with the universe's Satan, the world is still open to the Gods, what're ya gonna do now? I don't get it.
52
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Who/what did Mimara see?
« on: August 03, 2017, 03:02:21 pm »
If the Hundred are archons, then Mimara saw the Pleroma/One True God
53
The Unholy Consult / Re: Thoughs post-AMA slog
« on: August 03, 2017, 05:18:54 am »
So I guess in addition to wondering what kinda 4D chess maneuver Kellhus is aiming at whenever he opens his mouth in a normal scene we're supposed to guess he didn't want to be possessed by the demon god he made a pact with and that every word out of his mouth past some arbitrary point (shouldn't all of angogorea be a topos) is no longer him and we're supposed to somehow parse that out?
Way too convoluted man.
Way too convoluted man.
54
The Unholy Consult / Re: Thoughs post-AMA slog
« on: August 03, 2017, 03:47:03 am »
Kellhus does say he was trying to conquer Hell. Was his gambit the whole time killing two birds with one stone? Destroying the Consult and ruling hell? But how is the Eternal even a problem to begin with if Kellhus is a hunger that's supposed to conquer it, as in he must have always-already conquered it right? Were his motivations as base and uninspired as abooga wooga me am a god now? Literally final Fantasy-tier. None of this shit makes any fucking sense.
55
The Unholy Consult / [TUC Spoilers] Who/what did Mimara see?
« on: August 02, 2017, 09:35:05 pm »
Who protects Mimara? A genuine force for good? It says when she's looking through the Chorae that oblivion is the skin of a deeper light - do the Inchoroi, Nonmen, Dunyain all get caught on this void and its preceding levels because of their deficiency of spirit?
The big question is: even with all this depravity and horror and evil, is there a bona fide transcendent, supreme God/principle looking out for Mimara?
The big question is: even with all this depravity and horror and evil, is there a bona fide transcendent, supreme God/principle looking out for Mimara?
56
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]Deus Ex Machina - Implausibilities - Running out of Steam
« on: August 02, 2017, 09:20:55 pm »
Scott's axioms here - the contradiction that is ensouled biological machines, the obscure, abyssal ground of causality, the necessity of ignorance to make everyday life possible, the dangers of plumbing too far and too deep with technology, the tension between biological hungers and higher-order thought, the collapse of firm meaning in the wake of late stage capitalism - these were discernible in book 1.
Now we wanted to see how they'd play out in the story proper, and while the narrative sheen is as lustrous as ever, I feel like it's just been, philosophically, a retread. I guess "there are no truth bombs to drop" is kinda the poiny but when he's talking about the g-string finally coming off only to reveal another one, just flesh-colored this time, it's a little disappointing.
Now we wanted to see how they'd play out in the story proper, and while the narrative sheen is as lustrous as ever, I feel like it's just been, philosophically, a retread. I guess "there are no truth bombs to drop" is kinda the poiny but when he's talking about the g-string finally coming off only to reveal another one, just flesh-colored this time, it's a little disappointing.
57
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]Deus Ex Machina - Implausibilities - Running out of Steam
« on: August 02, 2017, 06:53:14 pm »
I loved the book but man I still don't have a clue what the fuck happened.
Kellhus clearly understands Damnation is a problem - so why make a pact with Ajokli, the greater evil, to crush the Consult and prevent resumption? Especially if he already knows the Inchoroi are supposed to win? Scott says Kellhus was planning to defeat the Consult all along, was he trying to take them out before he can really work on this whole Damnation thing? Just what's going on man? Yeah yeah, muh meaning crash space, but there's a limit to philosophical titty-twisters before it wears thin. It's a testament to how riveting the narrative itself can be that this philosophical mud-puddle underneath it all barely detracts from my enjoyment.
We got like 3 fuckin' different conceptions of the absolute, a whole clusterfuck of ways to think about the soul/the Gods' blindness, and what Kellhus was really trying to do/what happened in the end.
Kellhus clearly understands Damnation is a problem - so why make a pact with Ajokli, the greater evil, to crush the Consult and prevent resumption? Especially if he already knows the Inchoroi are supposed to win? Scott says Kellhus was planning to defeat the Consult all along, was he trying to take them out before he can really work on this whole Damnation thing? Just what's going on man? Yeah yeah, muh meaning crash space, but there's a limit to philosophical titty-twisters before it wears thin. It's a testament to how riveting the narrative itself can be that this philosophical mud-puddle underneath it all barely detracts from my enjoyment.
We got like 3 fuckin' different conceptions of the absolute, a whole clusterfuck of ways to think about the soul/the Gods' blindness, and what Kellhus was really trying to do/what happened in the end.
58
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Shauriatas
« on: August 02, 2017, 05:53:28 pm »
So with how evasive Scott's been it's p much guaranteed Shae is in the Mutilated. I hated the Dunyain fedora tippin' their way into the Consult twist probably the most out of anyone here, so I'm glad I'm wrong, though it's still a dumb "gotcha!" that really sucks the wind out of the sails of the one book in the series titled The Unholy fuckin' Consult
59
Author Q&A / Re: Midlist Authors & Online Piracy
« on: August 01, 2017, 10:17:52 pm »
I'll give it to you Scott for toughing it out and sticking to your guns. The genre community are a bunch of plebs, and lol at what academics think about anything.
60
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Metaphysics of the Second Apocalypse
« on: August 01, 2017, 09:28:33 pm »
The No-God is the embodiment of the void/Absolute, the void that is "as death" described in Fanim scripture.
If subject and object collapse in it, that's simply because the void is the (groundless) ground of both, and as such prior to both. WHAT DO YOU SEE and TELL ME WHAT I AM is simply that void's hunger to be, to be something.
The darkness that comes before is this void, as precisely this primordial obscurity and source of all hungers. So the no-god is literally the "god" of materialism, the god of a Tekne-obsessed race: the Void itself, and Zizek says as much, that the prime axiom of materialism isn't some facile permutation of "dude atoms lmao" but that the first principle is nothingness.
If subject and object collapse in it, that's simply because the void is the (groundless) ground of both, and as such prior to both. WHAT DO YOU SEE and TELL ME WHAT I AM is simply that void's hunger to be, to be something.
The darkness that comes before is this void, as precisely this primordial obscurity and source of all hungers. So the no-god is literally the "god" of materialism, the god of a Tekne-obsessed race: the Void itself, and Zizek says as much, that the prime axiom of materialism isn't some facile permutation of "dude atoms lmao" but that the first principle is nothingness.
