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Messages - TLEILAXU

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691
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Kelmomas, Nau-Cayuti and causality
« on: July 31, 2017, 01:48:01 am »
Quote from: Dunkelheit on July 30, 2017, 09:36:49 pm
I think you inserted the "soul" part yourself. Here is the quote (in context).

Quote from: Cû'jara-Cinmoi on July 28, 2017, 10:13:40 pm
Quote from: jurble on July 28, 2017, 07:57:15 pm
edit: Oh, and the entire time I thought Kelmomas was supposed to be twin-souled, was he actually meant to represent non-conscious human thought via bicameralism?

Shrewd observation regarding Kelmomas (I wasn't sure anyone would pick up on the conversation in the tent), though it isn't bicameralism so much as the absence of identity that's the crux.
He has to have a soul though, since the carapace needs a soul to revive the No-God AFAIK.

692
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]Deus Ex Machina - Implausibilities - Running out of Steam
« on: July 30, 2017, 09:38:43 pm »
Ah, that was kinda obvious in hindsight... Thanks.

693
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]Deus Ex Machina - Implausibilities - Running out of Steam
« on: July 30, 2017, 09:28:25 pm »
I don't understand why some of you guys expected everything to explicit and detailed answers to everything in the first place  ;)
Also, what does DEM mean? It's funny how you can identify Americans by their excessive use of abbreviations.

694
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Kelmomas, Nau-Cayuti and causality
« on: July 30, 2017, 08:10:41 pm »
Quote from: Yellow on July 30, 2017, 07:44:49 pm
Didn't RSB say in the q&a it was more to do with a lack of identity rather than a surfeit?
Yeah, a soul lacking an identity. Kellhus said something about how the darkness ruled him. Maybe that's it? Maybe Kel's soul is so damaged that he in some way has become the darkness before him, collapsing subject and object, becoming the No-God.

695
The Unholy Consult / Re: Dunyains on earth?
« on: July 30, 2017, 07:38:52 pm »
Well, the essence of Dûnyain philosophy seems to be that even though we are slaves to what comes before (also regarding determinism and free will, keep in mind we could live in a probabilistic universe such that neither perfect determinism and free will exist), the fact that we are able to comprehend this could lead us to eventually becoming self-moving through mastering the Logos, even as everything we do in pursuit of this also is a product of what comes before.

696
The Unholy Consult / Re: Conditioned ground
« on: July 30, 2017, 06:38:46 pm »
Quote
Did he anticipate his posession?
Yes
Quote
Did he anticipate his death
Probably not, but he might've prepared for the eventuality.
Quote
Did he anticipate the ressurection of the no-god via his son?
No.
Quote
Did he anticipate the arrival of mimara and drusas at golgotterah?
Probably.
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Did he anticipate moenghus reuniting with Cnaiur and assuming control of the horde?
Probably.
Quote
Did he anticipate Cnaiurs posession?
Probably not.
Quote
Is it possible he knew about Sorweal and wanted kelmonas to interrupt that assasination to set other events in motion?
No, unless you believe that Bakker is intentionally trying to mislead the reader.
Quote
without some of these moments set up by Kellhus im not sure why he abandons the ordeal to rescue esmenet and kelmomas from mommen
I don't know. He says something about Esmenet being his only darkness, only place he can hide etc.

697
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]Deus Ex Machina - Implausibilities - Running out of Steam
« on: July 30, 2017, 06:23:05 pm »
Quote from: Spooky on July 30, 2017, 02:45:41 pm
It would have been better than what we got. The Q&A had a whole lot of unrepentant teen espoused by Bakker. "I intended it to be confusing!"/ "My devoted and slavish proof readers weren't confused so clearly passionate reader and first time poster YOU ARE WRONG".

Good lord, at some point you have to age and maturity out of such responses.

The Book is vague and easily/deeply easy to misinterpret at the very best and its highly unlikely you could take a step back and look at the commentary here, at Westeros, Reddit, RPGNET and Goodreads and draw any other evidence based conclusion.

I hope he changes that tone or the Reddit AMA is going to be...interesting.



"I meant the finale and denouement to be confusing/inspire vigorous disagreement/cause spontaneous outrage on all available niche sites" said no honest serious writer or communicator ever.


Oh and we are all just pretending the pandering Cunny loving 100 foot Dragon dialogue wasn't there, right? Because it felt like Scott was talking to his critics from the first firestorm he became embroiled in, with the feminists.
Lol'd. "The author didn't do what I wanted, he's an immature teen".
Stay tuned for the AMA.

698
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]Kellhus-Decapitant, Baby or his own Niché in the Outside
« on: July 29, 2017, 09:36:40 pm »
Given that answer and given the glossary entry on the Decapitants I think the most likely explanation is that he is hiding in the head next to Malowebi.

699
Author Q&A / Re: Unholy Consultation - *SUPER SPOILERIFIC*
« on: July 29, 2017, 06:10:40 pm »
Is the caged Dûnyain a defective? "on a voice like bundled reeds" <- was he in the process of getting his larynx removed when the Consult attacked?

700
Author Q&A / Re: Unholy Consultation - *SUPER SPOILERIFIC*
« on: July 29, 2017, 04:10:46 pm »
Quote from: Anwurat on July 29, 2017, 02:57:53 pm
Wait, the Mutilated are the sons of Imimorul? Also, such a bummer about the lost posts...
No, he's referring to Ciogli's second question.  Also, the Mutilated might actually be Kellhus's literal brothers. We know that Kellhus is a prodigy among the Dûnyain, and the only other Dûnyain survivors we see also happen to be Anasûrimbors. Coincidence? Maybe, maybe not...

Bummer about the lost answers, Bakker. Is there a planned date for the AMA yet?

701
Author Q&A / Re: Unholy Consultation - *SUPER SPOILERIFIC*
« on: July 29, 2017, 01:03:30 am »
Quote from: Cû'jara-Cinmoi on July 28, 2017, 10:13:40 pm
Shrewd observation regarding Kelmomas (I wasn't sure anyone would pick up on the conversation in the tent), though it isn't bicameralism so much as the absence of identity that's the crux.
Does that means he is in some sense like a Sranc? Is that why the Gods can't see him?

Also, can you expand a bit on what is meant by "You realized the Mission was not to master Cause via Logos, but to master Cause via Cause, to endlessly refashion the Near to consume and incorporate the Far." ? Does it mean that more and more elaborated machinery will converge to a self-moving soul?

702
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]What was the point
« on: July 29, 2017, 12:42:42 am »
Quote from: Redeagl on July 28, 2017, 11:16:49 pm
Quote from: panorama on July 28, 2017, 06:10:48 am
Quote from: Woden on July 27, 2017, 07:56:33 pm
Quote from: Wilshire on July 27, 2017, 07:23:54 pm
I worry for Bakker's future publications .

Me too. What about the critics' reviews?
Personally, I'd like to return my copy and get my money back because I feel like I've been ripped off and the author is giving a big middle finger to the reader.

Barring that, I'll just have to settle for reviewing it on Goodreads, Amazon, Barnes & Noble, etc. so that there are sufficient buyer-beware warnings out there. Probably referencing the scene where a little boy is murdered while crying out for his mommy will be sufficient warning about what this book is like. Or maybe referencing one of the many, many scenes of gang rape or necrophilia.
.....
Wow, that's just blatant trolling. You don't read 7 books of The Second Apocalypse only to be offended by rape or child abuse at the very last one. I say circumfix the guy!

703
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]The effects of Chorae
« on: July 29, 2017, 12:39:56 am »
The way I remember/interpret it, Serwa doesn't take a direct hit to her skin.

704
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]What was the point
« on: July 28, 2017, 08:08:06 pm »
Quote from: MSJ on July 28, 2017, 05:33:01 pm
Quote from: Tleilaxu
It's not a good thing, but that's the thing. Humanity is kinda fucked either way. Either live as slaves to hungry Gods forever or face nigh extermination and horror at the hands of the No-God to close the Outside. But overall, the latter is the lesser evil, especially in the context of TUC where the other option was Ajokli reigning on Eärwa. Despite the villains being "not good", the end result is good. Unless you want to live in a world with Gods of course.

Ahh, but your assuming its over and thats the only two options. As i said in other threads, Kellhus came to believe in humans. I think he tricked Ajokli, knowing Ajokli nature and there is textual evidence inthe books (see Cnauir and whirlwind).  What if Kellhus is warring on the Outside to defeat the 100 and thus changing the nature of damnation, no big bad gods to munch on your souls. And, has faith that humanity can and will overcome the No-God. As CondYoke pointed out if the Gods can see all of time then if the world was ever shut, they couldnt see anything...ever. Meaning that somehow, someway humanity will defeat the No-God. Anyhow, your acting as if the story is complete and its not. There is still more to come.
I see. That's where we disagree then. The way I see it,  Kellhus was very much in league with Ajokli e.g. "struck a treaty with the Pit", "his siblings are hunting him, he thinks he can hide here" etc. Kellhus wanted infinite power for himself through Ajokli, that is his madness and his path to the absolute. The thing about the Gods seeing is a good point, but Kellhus also says something that they are re-writing the Gods in Golgotterath, that the assassins sent that were doomed to succeed from the beginning become  doomed to fail etc. It's kinda confusing. I don't think the story is complete, but I don't think that the No-God is going to be defeated either.

705
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers]What was the point
« on: July 28, 2017, 05:15:45 pm »
Quote from: MSJ on July 28, 2017, 03:11:49 pm
Tleilaxu, I'll give in on the first, if that was really Kellhus's plan. Mind you, im of the opinion he tricked the Trickster and is waging war on the Outside to stop damnation. No 100, no one to munch your souls.

But, technology is still being used to destroy a planet. I dont see how this in anyway can be looked at as a good thing. Remember, Earwa is just a continent. There are 2 more that we kbow of and might be more across the great sea. So, the No-God destroys EVERYONE on Earwa and the Outside is still not shut, what then? Move on to Eanna, and kill everyone there and still.....not shut. When does it end? What would be left?
It's not a good thing, but that's the thing. Humanity is kinda fucked either way. Either live as slaves to hungry Gods forever or face nigh extermination and horror at the hands of the No-God to close the Outside. But overall, the latter is the lesser evil, especially in the context of TUC where the other option was Ajokli reigning on Eärwa. Despite the villains being "not good", the end result is good. Unless you want to live in a world with Gods of course.

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