The Second Apocalypse

Earwa => The Aspect-Emperor => The Unholy Consult => Topic started by: Redeagl on June 09, 2017, 03:14:54 pm

Title: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Redeagl on June 09, 2017, 03:14:54 pm
Since the Quorum is prohibited, we can continue here the questions :)
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Madness on June 09, 2017, 03:19:08 pm
Thanks you two :)!

Much appreciated.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 03:19:48 pm
Yay!

Did you guys come out of a reread, or when did you last read the previous installments, in particular TGO?
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 09, 2017, 03:22:12 pm
Alright, overall thoughts: [non spoilery for anything specific in book, but any discussion of pacing, etc. will yield pseudo spoilers if you read into em.  Read at own risk]

1: Stylistically this is most similar to TTT.  We are finally getting to the fireworks factory.
2: It is RSB at his Bakker-est, if that makes any sense.  If you dug the other books in spite of the Bakkerisms, this will be rough for you.  If you dug them FOR his particular quirks, then this is right up your alley.
3: This is now my favorite Bakker book, previously TWP was the one I liked most.
4: Be careful about spoilers.  There are a lot of twists and turns in the plot that are amazing when they happen with no warnings.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Redeagl on June 09, 2017, 03:22:35 pm
Yay!

Did you guys come out of a reread, or when did you last read the previous installments, in particular TGO?
I didn't reread TAE. Only read a few chapters from TJE,TWLW and TGO right before TUC. I did complete a PoN reread in March though.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 09, 2017, 03:23:28 pm
@Hiro 3:

Yeah, I did a reread of the whole series reading up to this, finishing TGO the night before my copy arrived, so everything was fresh in my mind.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 03:27:26 pm
Yay!

Did you guys come out of a reread, or when did you last read the previous installments, in particular TGO?
I didn't reread TAE. Only read a few chapters from TJE,TWLW and TGO right before TUC. I did complete a PoN reread in March though.

Thanks, good to know, to place your comments in a context. I've just finished my PON reread, and into TJE now.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 03:28:00 pm
@Hiro 3:

Yeah, I did a reread of the whole series reading up to this, finishing TGO the night before my copy arrived, so everything was fresh in my mind.

My plan in a nutshell... thanks.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: MSJ on June 09, 2017, 03:53:51 pm
Mine too, almost done TTT. Need to really not watch TV and read rest of June. I had thought of skipping TJE and TWLW and just doing TGO, though.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 03:55:10 pm
Mine too, almost done TTT. Need to really not watch TV and read rest of June. I had thought of skipping TJE and TWLW and just doing TGO, though.

It had crossed my mind, but I finally figured, let's just go for completeness sake all-the-Slog's-way.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 09, 2017, 03:56:21 pm
The 'What Has Gone Before' sections are usually enough, but I'm super invested in these books so I like the complete read throughs.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 03:57:05 pm
The 'What Has Gone Before' sections are usually enough, but I'm super invested in these books so I like the complete read throughs.

I'm skipping those sections, and the TTT glossary. 'Just' the text itself.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 09, 2017, 03:59:10 pm
Make sure you read TUC's glossary after the book itself.  There are some references to stuff in TUC in there.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 04:04:04 pm
Make sure you read TUC's glossary after the book itself.  There are some references to stuff in TUC in there.

So I'd gathered from Wert.

As a further reference, Walter, might I ask what other books do you enjoy / rate highly?
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 09, 2017, 04:11:27 pm
Stephen R Donaldson's books are some of my favorite, and I'd never turn down a Joe Abercrombie (although, really I think he's gone downhill since The First Law).  I enjoyed some of the earlier Malazan books, but ultimately fell out of love with the series.  I read the Wheel of Time and dug it, actually thought Sanderson's stuff at the end was an improvement over Robert Jordan's later work.  I like Sanderson's current series, but never could get into his superhero stuff.

In general, I'm generally a sucker for dark fantasy stuff.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 04:20:52 pm
Stephen R Donaldson's books are some of my favorite, and I'd never turn down a Joe Abercrombie (although, really I think he's gone downhill since The First Law).  I enjoyed some of the earlier Malazan books, but ultimately fell out of love with the series.  I read the Wheel of Time and dug it, actually thought Sanderson's stuff at the end was an improvement over Robert Jordan's later work.  I like Sanderson's current series, but never could get into his superhero stuff.

In general, I'm generally a sucker for dark fantasy stuff.

Thank you.

SRD is one of my faves as well. Haven't read Joe Abercr, or the Wheel of Time (no interest after reading the prologue). Have read Gardens of the Moon, and part 2 is on my list.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 09, 2017, 06:41:32 pm
Alright, overall thoughts: [non spoilery for anything specific in book, but any discussion of pacing, etc. will yield pseudo spoilers if you read into em.  Read at own risk]

1: Stylistically this is most similar to TTT.  We are finally getting to the fireworks factory.
2: It is RSB at his Bakker-est, if that makes any sense.  If you dug the other books in spite of the Bakkerisms, this will be rough for you.  If you dug them FOR his particular quirks, then this is right up your alley.
3: This is now my favorite Bakker book, previously TWP was the one I liked most.
4: Be careful about spoilers.  There are a lot of twists and turns in the plot that are amazing when they happen with no warnings.

I'll take a small bite: what would you define as a 'Bakkerism'? Could you give a (non-TUC) example or two?
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: MSJ on June 09, 2017, 09:26:54 pm
Stephen R Donaldson's books are some of my favorite, and I'd never turn down a Joe Abercrombie (although, really I think he's gone downhill since The First Law).  I enjoyed some of the earlier Malazan books, but ultimately fell out of love with the series.  I read the Wheel of Time and dug it, actually thought Sanderson's stuff at the end was an improvement over Robert Jordan's later work.  I like Sanderson's current series, but never could get into his superhero stuff.

In general, I'm generally a sucker for dark fantasy stuff.

Thank you.

SRD is one of my faves as well. Haven't read Joe Abercr, or the Wheel of Time (no interest after reading the prologue). Have read Gardens of the Moon, and part 2 is on my list.

Hiro, Malazan is really good if your in for the long haul. Also, Abercrombie is probably the funniest fantasy author I've read.

ETA: Also Esselmonts Dancer trilogy, 1st on Dancer's Lament came out last year is really good. Tell how the Malazan Empirre came into being.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 10, 2017, 06:22:30 pm
Stephen R Donaldson's books are some of my favorite, and I'd never turn down a Joe Abercrombie (although, really I think he's gone downhill since The First Law).  I enjoyed some of the earlier Malazan books, but ultimately fell out of love with the series.  I read the Wheel of Time and dug it, actually thought Sanderson's stuff at the end was an improvement over Robert Jordan's later work.  I like Sanderson's current series, but never could get into his superhero stuff.

In general, I'm generally a sucker for dark fantasy stuff.

Thank you.

SRD is one of my faves as well. Haven't read Joe Abercr, or the Wheel of Time (no interest after reading the prologue). Have read Gardens of the Moon, and part 2 is on my list.

Hiro, Malazan is really good if your in for the long haul. Also, Abercrombie is probably the funniest fantasy author I've read.

ETA: Also Esselmonts Dancer trilogy, 1st on Dancer's Lament came out last year is really good. Tell how the Malazan Empirre came into being.

Thanks for the further feedback, MSJ. I'll dip my toe further into the Malazan pool, curious about book 2 and 3. After TUC, though, and there are many other books waiting as well fantasy and non-fantasy.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 15, 2017, 06:20:47 pm
Does TUC clarify the path where the 3rd series might take us...?

No need to specify.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Redeagl on June 15, 2017, 06:24:35 pm
Does TUC clarify the path where the 3rd series might take us...?

No need to specify.
Yes, it did.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 15, 2017, 06:25:42 pm
Yeah, you won't be in doubt about where the third series might go to.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 15, 2017, 06:27:00 pm
Yeah, you won't be in doubt about where the third series might go to.

Thanks guys. That will be interesting after soooo much mystery!
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 15, 2017, 06:27:32 pm
Does TUC clarify the path where the 3rd series might take us...?

No need to specify.
Yes, it did.

Red, so what is your rating and verdict, having finished TUC?
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: themerchant on June 28, 2017, 11:12:24 pm
I'm loving it so far just about to start chapter 9.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 29, 2017, 12:21:47 pm
Glad to hear you are liking it!
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: themerchant on June 29, 2017, 01:27:01 pm
Had to stop before i moved on to chapter 19 as was getting too tired. Just about to resume.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 29, 2017, 01:57:02 pm
Had to stop before i moved on to chapter 19 as was getting too tired. Just about to resume.

Chapter 19, holymoly, you did just almost read through it in one night?!?!
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Madness on June 29, 2017, 02:10:34 pm
Waits... eleven years for the finale of the second series. Reads it in a night ;).

Gluttons!
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 29, 2017, 02:36:56 pm
Waits... eleven years for the finale of the second series. Reads it in a night ;).

Gluttons!

Gluttons...for the MEAT!
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: themerchant on June 29, 2017, 02:51:28 pm
Aye and only moved a chapter since then.  Getting dense.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: themerchant on June 29, 2017, 06:47:05 pm
I've finished it now.

It was wild!!
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 29, 2017, 07:04:17 pm
I've finished it now.

It was wild!!

Wild how?

and

Was it worth the rush to Glasgow, the binge-reading and bathing...?

and

How do you rate it compared to the other novels?

;)
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: themerchant on June 29, 2017, 08:03:05 pm
I'll let you find out for yourself :)

Yeah well worth it, not even started the Glossary yet :D

It's the best out of the 4 in TAE. I hesitate to say it's the best one so far in the series as i'm not as familiar with it as others, but I think it might be my favourite.

I need a re-read. :p

Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Hiro on June 29, 2017, 08:10:22 pm
Coolness, just more grease for the anticipation gears. ;)
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Walter on June 30, 2017, 02:16:31 am
Way to go merch!  It was definitely my favorite.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: themerchant on June 30, 2017, 03:12:41 am
I'm not going to discuss too much atm though. next week everyone who really wants and can afford a copy will be able to get the kindle version.

I know what i'm like with spoilers, sometimes you can't help yourself clicking. So not going to put anything out there till next week.

I AM going to re-read it though and see how it reads with the benefit of already being read.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: mostly.harmless on June 30, 2017, 11:30:12 pm
Holy shit.

Sent from mobile using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: locke on July 01, 2017, 02:32:28 am
I've read it as well but I haven't posted anything because I haven't finished the glossary, I'm only up to f or something.

I have had the inverse reaction I had to great ordeal. With great ordeal I was ecstatic for quite a while about everything but then gradually came off that high and am now a bit more critical of the book. Though I'm currently listening to TGO on audio and it is really quite excellent.

My reaction to TUC is more muted, much related to exhaustion (I finished it three marathon evenings of readings )some disappointment melded with general holy fuckery mixed in with the excitement and some "wait what?" Elements and a bit of narrative separation for the reader from the accelerating pace of TGO. It's almost disorienting to read, as it is so much continuous climax.

But the more I have ruminated on the book the more I like it. This book ripples my understanding of the previous books, at least as far back as warrior prophet in fairly substantial reconfigurations of interpretative perspective given newly obtained information. Some things seem much simpler and at least one factor seems far more complex than anyone has ever considered because no one has ever gone there at any point. I expect this avenue will be a dominant core of discussion going forward and it originates from a fairly holy fuckery moment I never saw coming that makes complete sense. Can't wait to see everyone's reactions to the book.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Yellow on July 01, 2017, 11:16:02 am
I finished it last night. Oof, that ending.

It definitely felt like the second half to TGO, so less of a standalone book than any of the others, which lets it down a bit. The second half was very well done though.

There were a lot of questions unanswered and some plot threads left hanging, which annoyed me. I was really annoyed at how one of the aspects of the book played out (not going to spoil it for anyone, though).

Overall though, I'll say it again: oof, that ending. There were a couple of things that I have questions on that I'll be posting soon!
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Madness on July 01, 2017, 12:11:55 pm
Holy shit.

Sent from mobile using Tapatalk



Lol.

...

I've updated Tapatalk again, locke, sorry about the double posts - I hope that's the solve.

This book ripples my understanding of the previous books, at least as far back as warrior prophet in fairly substantial reconfigurations of interpretative perspective given newly obtained information. Some things seem much simpler and at least one factor seems far more complex than anyone has ever considered because no one has ever gone there at any point. I expect this avenue will be a dominant core of discussion going forward and it originates from a fairly holy fuckery moment I never saw coming that makes complete sense. Can't wait to see everyone's reactions to the book.

This makes me very excited for general release.

I finished it last night. Oof, that ending.

It definitely felt like the second half to TGO, so less of a standalone book than any of the others, which lets it down a bit. The second half was very well done though.

4/4?

How did you find one, Yellow :)?
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Yellow on July 01, 2017, 03:17:55 pm
 :P

Just mean the narrative arc was a bit lacking. If the two had stayed as intended as one (massive) book, it would have been amazing.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: Madness on July 01, 2017, 03:20:47 pm
Interesting. Isn't The Aspect-Emperor one massive book?
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: themerchant on July 01, 2017, 04:23:55 pm
Aye it'd have been even better if it was one big massive book, but it would have been better if TGO and TUC hadn't been split.

Although i guess the same could be said of any multi-book story, they'd all be better at once, but like the gods it doesn't work that way.
Title: Re: [TUC SPOILERS] Walter and Redeagl on TUC...
Post by: MSJ on July 01, 2017, 08:42:03 pm
Could we keep spoilers tagged til after the 6th at least?