Excerpt - The Unholy Consult, Chapter One

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« Reply #30 on: May 15, 2013, 04:45:25 pm »
Quote from: Wilshire
Not a bad theory Church.

Perhaps the no-god projects his soul into all the sranc that are under his control. Thus controlling the gibbering multitudes like appendages of his own body. We dont know why the sranc follow the no god, how they are controlled, and (correct me if im wrong) we have no evidence as to whether or not sranc have souls. If they don't, well, it would make the whole process even simpler to 'possess' or somehow implant  the no-god's 'soul' into them all, making them do his bidding though maintaining enough 'intellect' to rape and pillage when not being directly controlled.

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« Reply #31 on: May 15, 2013, 04:45:33 pm »
Quote from: Tony P
Just thinking out loud here, but could...

Quote from: Church
the soul-splitting  / movement through separate carriers

...be the same principle in which Seswatha is cycling part of his consciousness/his memories through the Mandate? Could he be using the same principle to either keep the memory of the First Apocalypse alive, or even more perversely, himself? I'm not sure how I feel about that last bit. That would make him seem to be in league with the Consult.

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« Reply #32 on: May 15, 2013, 04:45:39 pm »
Quote from: lockesnow
on westeros I postulated that Seswatha's heart is in fact Nau Cayuti's heart and that it was recovered from the carapace of the No God after the NG was destroyed.  In a sense NC's heart could be the heart of the NoGod, or one of them at least.

Here's a thought playing off of that, and the above thought of TonyP.

What if the Mandate, by preserving Seswatha's heart, have kept the No God alive, that this one piece of the No God they have, and have preserved, is what makes the Second Apocalypse possible.

Is Seswatha's Heart equivalent to the One Ring?

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« Reply #33 on: May 15, 2013, 04:45:46 pm »
Quote from: Triskele
Quote from: lockesnow
Here's a thought playing off of that, and the above thought of TonyP.

What if the Mandate, by preserving Seswatha's heart, have kept the No God alive, that this one piece of the No God they have, and have preserved, is what makes the Second Apocalypse possible.

Is Seswatha's Heart equivalent to the One Ring?

If this were possibly true, wouldn't we need to assume that The Consult was well-aware of this?

I don't think it's a bluff on the part of the author or the skin spies that Moe has interrogated that The Consult does indeed believe that it is close to reviving the No-God. 

So if The Mandate was somehow playing a part with a key object, wouldn't The Consult need to get it back?  Kind of like how Seswatha (we're told) needed to get the Heron Spear out of the Ark?

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« Reply #34 on: May 15, 2013, 04:45:53 pm »
Quote from: lockesnow
speaking of the heron spear, this excerpt does suggest that the Consult feared the Heron Spear.  And note that this is years before the No God is realized.

I'm guessing that Bakker is going to use the NC dreams throughout the book to explain the entire process of how the NG was realized.

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« Reply #35 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:00 pm »
Quote from: Borric
Quote from: lockesnow
speaking of the heron spear, this excerpt does suggest that the Consult feared the Heron Spear.  And note that this is years before the No God is realized.

Eh?
This is just before the No-God arrives.

http://princeofnothing.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline

take a look at the date 2140
the no-god is summoned two years later.

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« Reply #36 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:07 pm »
Quote from: lockesnow
I'd say if the timeframe is two years away, that "years away" is a more accurate description than "just before" :D

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« Reply #37 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:13 pm »
Quote from: Triskele
It's interesting that Shae/Shaur mentions that NC's wife was motivated to forestall her damnation. 

Presumably there would be a lot of folks who would actually be rooting for the Consult if they understood what was going on.

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« Reply #38 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:19 pm »
Quote from: Wilshire
Its all about propaganda Triskele. As bakker says, no muslim children are born to christian families, errmmm i mean "no fanim children are born to inrithi households"

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« Reply #39 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:25 pm »
Quote from: Madness
The Consult should torch their PR guy.

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« Reply #40 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:30 pm »
Quote from: Wilshire
Quote from: Madness
The Consult should torch their PR guy.
maybe they did, and got a new one, several times, until there were only a few consult left = P

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« Reply #41 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:36 pm »
Quote from: Cursed Armada
So who thinks that Ishaul is empty and who thinks it has some type of survivor within? As much as I'd love to see a survivor within Isaul, I don't think Bakker will give us that much...

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« Reply #42 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:41 pm »
Quote from: Wilshire
'cmon. one does not simply 'kill' ALL the dunyain

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« Reply #43 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:48 pm »
Quote from: Triskele
I still think that there's a chance that Saccares is a Dunyain. 

I won't be surprised either way, but not only does he learn the metagnostic cants, but he talks like Kellhus in a manipulative way at one point in a way that really seemed like it could have been a subtle hint from Bakker.

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« Reply #44 on: May 15, 2013, 04:46:54 pm »
Quote from: Wilshire
Quote
"No Schoolmen was as famed as Apperens Saccarees, who had lng stood high among the Empier's Exalt-Ministers. His voice proved a tonic for the Arm of the South's nightly war-councils, for it carried both the authority of the Aspect-Emperor and the promise of tactical acumen."
Pg. 456 

Quote
"Could it be?" Carindusu asked in derision. "Have the fabled Dreams of the First Apocalpse led the illustrious Saccarees astray?"
"Yes," the Mandate Grandmaster replied, his honesty so genuine, his humility so reminiscent of their Lord-and-God, that Carindusu found himself shamed before his peers a third time.
Pg. 460

My bold in both cases.
Also note that on page 491  Saccarees himself destroys the grandmaster of the Vokalati, and is then attacked by "fairly half the Vokalati", who he also presumably destroys. He of course survives this, but what a powerful schoolman to take out half a school by himself unscathed. Perhaps too powerful to be a mere human?
Remember that Akka took on the grandmaster of the Spires and 4 other sorcerers of rank, killing 2 of them, and barely escaping with his life. Not a grandmaster, but its been speculated that Akka is very strong and has been kept in the field for political reasons. He isn't your typical lowly field spy.