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Messages - Swayal Serpent

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16
The Unholy Consult / Re: How big is Sil?
« on: August 05, 2017, 06:06:52 pm »
I think all of the Inchoroi were enormous when they first came to Earwa, as evidenced by Aurang wrestling Ciogli to the ground. But after all the grafts that they put themselves through, Aurang and Aurax don't even resemble what they were when they stepped off the arc

17
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Ranking the books after TUC
« on: August 01, 2017, 08:32:06 pm »
Quote
So did the Great Ordeal of Anasûrimbor Kellhus perish in salt and butchery.

Bakker, R. Scott. The Unholy Consult: Book Four of the Aspect-Emperor series (Aspect Emperor 4) (Kindle Locations 8250-8251). Little, Brown Book Group. Kindle Edition.

I like TTT's final sentence more.

(Psst; it's my sig.)

Absolutely, the TTT ending is flawless, and the final sentence still brings a tear to my eye

[EDIT Madness: Fixed a quote tag.]

18
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Ranking the books after TUC
« on: August 01, 2017, 02:26:18 am »
Ok I'm going to have to revise my ranking with a bit of explanation for each one. Of course I'm sure it will change again, it's just so hard to decide

1. TTT- Positives: 1. Almost nonstop action and revelation. Plenty of badass sorcery, The SS assault on the Cishaurim, Kellhus' battle with the primaries, and Akka's battle with the Saik are just a few examples. Kel and Moe's conversation. It revealed many things, and was great closure for Kel's quest to find his father. Moe and Cnaiur's reunion, just such a great conclusion for Cnaiur's arc in PON. 2. The ending. The final scene where Akka repudiates Kellhus still gives me chills when I read it, it's the greatest ending to any novel I've ever read imo. 3. Lots of information and explanation, but still plenty of mystery. For me this book was thd perfect combo of answering questions, yet leaving enough to keep you hungry for what's to come.

Negatives: None. It's perfect

2. TWLW- Positives: 1. The Ordeal has its first big battles in this book, and we get to see a demonstration of Kellhus' incredible power when he obliterates multitudes of Sranc on his way to rescue Sacarees and the others. 2. Proyas takes his first steps toward the realization that Kellhus is false, I really loved that arc. 3. Akka and Cleric's battle with Wutteat was so badass, and the subsequent confrontation between Akka and Cleric was all the more touching and tragic because of it. It was just such a great send off for Nil'Giccas. 3. the scene with Maithanet and Inrilitas. It remains one of my favorite passages of the series, and my heart was pounding the whole time, it was so thrilling
Negatives: 1.The momemn scenes were fairly boring (with one exception), and Kelmomas was becoming a very tiring Character to read

3.TWP- Positiives: 1. The transformation of the Holy War was done so well, it's even better on a re read. 2. Cnaiur's descent into madness. Only Cnaiur could make going insane look so badass. 3. The circumfixtion, and the subsequent effort's of Cnaiur and Akka to convince the great names to free him, I especially love Akka's speech to the great names when he tries to convice them of the danger if the Consult. 4. Akka's escape from the SS at Iothaia. When Akka put the smackdown on his former captors, then defeated the Ciphrang Iyokus summoned.... this was the point where I knew I'd be a Bakker fan for life, and what cemented Achamian as my favorite character. It was written so well, and was just an awesome scene.
Negatives: 1.Overly long, and at times could be a bit dull. 2. Too much Serwe. I know that Bakker has hinted at her importance to the overall story, but I just really, really hate her. 3. The scene when Kellhus pulled out Serwe's heart was just too opaque for me. I know that Bakker isn't known for his transparency, but this scene was definitely the worst offender for me

4.TDTCB- Positives: 1.Excellent worldbuilding. This book shows how unique and incredible the world of Earwa is. 2.The prologue, pretty sure it speaks for itself. 3. Conversations between Cnaiur and Kellhus, once again, I think it speaks for itself. 4. The council of great and lesser names, and subsequent reveal of a skin spy. Ending a fantasy book with a debate is so brilliant and unique, and the skin spy revelation was a great way to keep people reading.
Negatives: 1. Very dense. Not exactly friendly to first time readers, and I was actually very bored when I read it for the first time. Of course, after rereading it, I realized just how great the book is. 2. Almost no action, and even less sorcery. I love the magic in these books, and want to see as much as possible. 3. Once again, too much Serwe. I just can't stand her. 4. Hated the Esmenet chapters. I quite like her character, but in this book I wanted to skip over her chapters.

5. TUC- Positives: 1. The battle for Min Uroikas. It was EPIC, and the prose used to describe it was excellent. We finally got to see Golgotterath in all its might fave off against TGO. 2. Kellhus' betrayal of Proyas. Perfect conclusion to Proyas' struggle with his faith. Very tragic, and led to a reunion with his old tutor. 3. Loads of info. This is a tought one because a lot of what was revealed is still shrouded in mystery, but there were still a few twists that I would have never seen coming. The Dunsult, and Ajokli's possession being the main ones. 4. The final sentence. I know this seems like a small thing, but holy shit that last sentence sent a chill up my spine, really loved the bleak finality.
Negatives: 1. Nor very accessible. While there were many things revealed, it was all done in such an opaque way that much of the revelations are up to interpretation. I never expected full clarity, but this was a slight disappointment. 2. The OG Consult. This was probably the biggest letdown for me. They were built up so much, but they ended up being less threatening to Kellhus than sorwheel was. I thought that the Consult would be one of the few forces in the world that could possiblly come close to the standing up to the Dunyain, but even they were still as children to Kellhus and the Dunsult. 3. Loose ends. Of course this is to be expected from the middle of the series, but the complete lack of Meppa and Crabicus (among other things) was frustrating,

6. TJE- Positives: 1. Introduction of Cleric. I think everyone can agree that Cleric was a highlight of the entire TSA series. 2. Cil Aujas. This part was just awesome for so many reasons. It was the first time we saw a real battle against Inchoroi creations (e.g Sranc, and Bashrag), and we got to see Cleric wreck shop.
Negatives: It's difficult to pinpoint anything exactly, but this book was just lacking in comparison to the. The momemn chapters were pretty boring imo, and Sorweel was a very uninteresting character in this book

7.TGO- Positives: Korringhus. These chapters were great. I really loved the interactions between him, Akka, and Mom 2. The nuke at Dahliash. The revelation that the Consult had nukes was awesome, and Saubon's subsequent death was so dark and tragic, but such and excellent part of the story. 3. Cnaiur. Nuff said
Negatives: 1. Mainly setup. This was my main problem. Because TGO was supposed to be half of TUC, it suffered from being mainly an introductiont to the finale. 2. Too dark. Bleakness and darkness don't bother me in a story, but this particular book seemed so filled with despair that it took away from the story. Unlike TUC, there was no climax to all the hopelesness, so it was just difficult to really enjoy. Kinda like just watching the first half of Empire Strikes Back

Well that's it. Sorry for the overlong post, but I've been lurking on the forum since I discovered TSA 2 years ago, but I just started posting a couple days ago, so I've got alot to say! Thanks to anyone who reads through this whole thing


19
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Kosoter
« on: August 01, 2017, 12:03:27 am »
Sorry, back to Kosoter.  I would have been satisfied with his storyline, were it not for that RSB comment about not being done.  Unless it's a reverse to the 'Cnaiur's storyline is done' way back ago.  Ha!  I don't know if I have any other thoughts on this particular subject.

Haha that would be brilliant if Bakker pulled a reverse Cnaiur, just to keep everyone on their toes

20
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Inchoroi souls
« on: July 31, 2017, 11:59:52 pm »
Remember, artificiality doesn't affect whether or not you have a soul.  The Skin Spy who was able to work sorcery had a soul and so do a few apes and whales.  Yes, the Inchoroi had souls.  As for the number "a thousand thousand", that's simply a chronicler's way of saying "there's a fuckton of those bastards."  Numbers are really unreliable in pre modern history (and that's ignoring the arguments one can have over numbers and statistics.)

I didn't really think that artificiality necessarily precluded having a soul, just that it's usually some crazy fluke when it happens. As for a thousand thousand of them, I probably was taking that a bit literally. As for the Dunyain explaining that Sil created the inverse fire to remind them of their damnnation, I must have missed reading that part. I suppose that's the final nail for my theory. Ah well, guess I'll just file this one under crackpot

21
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Shauriatas
« on: July 31, 2017, 11:49:39 pm »
Shae is right there, he's the Mutilated.  He resisted and they lost.

Woah, that's an awesome theory, never even crossed my mind. But iirc, Kellhus killed one of the mutilated. Obviously we know very little about soul trapping, but wouldn't destroying one of the bodies cause a major problem, if not outright kill the soul inhabiting it? I really have nothing to base that on, but I don't see any reason to have 5 host boddies unless all are necessary. But I love that theory, though it seems very unlikely, I hope its true

22
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Shauriatas
« on: July 31, 2017, 11:46:18 pm »
The mutilated mention that Shae was the only Consult member that stood against them, and that's why they killed him. Why would Shae refuse when all the other consult joined?

Shaeonanra actually answers this question himself in The False Sun.  The reason he wanted Titirga dead was because, if he had come over to the Consult, Shae would not be top dog anymore.  Titirga, being the badass he was, would have usurped Shae in a heartbeat.  Shae's ego wouldn't have that, so down Titirga went.  History repeating itself with the Dunyain.  You know, that old chestnut.

Your absolutely right, I didn't think of that. But even so, it seems that if you've been alive for 3000 years, doing anything and everything in your power to avoid death because it is literally the worst thing that could ever happen to you, that you would probably back the big dogs if you had too. In fact it seems that the presence of the Dunyain was a major boone to the Consults machinations, and really would have been benificial to Shae. Ah well, I guess even after 3000 years, Shauriatas still couldn't swallow his pride

23
The Unholy Consult / [TUC Spoilers] Shauriatas
« on: July 31, 2017, 05:46:35 pm »
He's been touched on in other threads, but I thought Shae deserved one of his own to discuss his role (or lack thereof) in TUC. Personally I was quite disappointed with his offscreen demise. He was a very powerful sorcerer and very clever as well, I was really hoping he would have something to do in TUC. The mutilated mention that Shae was the only Consult member that stood against them, and that's why they killed him. Why would Shae refuse when all the other consult joined? That being said, I actually kind of feel bad for him. Hes spent 3,000 years trying to escape damnnation, and just when things are starting to look good for him, some Dunyain come along and squash him like a bug, sending him to the outside that he dreaded so much

24
The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Inchoroi souls
« on: July 31, 2017, 03:20:42 am »
Yes the Inchoroi have souls. Otherwise they wouldn't see anything in the Inverse Fire.

Well there's never really any evidence of the Inchoroi looking into the inverse fire, is there? It seems to be a tool they use to show other people their damnnation, but as far as I can tell, there isn't any mention of the inchoroi being motivated by the inverse fire

25
The Unholy Consult / [TUC Spoilers] Inchoroi souls
« on: July 31, 2017, 02:20:09 am »
So I always assumed that the inchoroi were ensouled beings just like Non Men, and Men. But it is revealed in TUC that they are essentially a more advanced weapon race that has been tasked with eliminating damnnation. It appeared as though they had souls because their mission to shut the world seemed to be predicated on their own fear of damnnation.  But according to the mutilated, they are simply artificial beings, same as Sranc, and are simply doing what their programming demands. After reading TUC, im almost certain that inchoroi have no souls. In addition to what we learned from the mutilated, I also remember a passage from one of the books that said something along the lines of "Even though the arc's crash killed most of the inchoroi, a thousand thousand of them still descend upon Earwa" (if any one knows which quote I'm referencing, I would appreciate an exact quote). It seems that the goal is to reduce Earwa's soul population to 144,000, in order to shut the outside. If that's the case, then adding a million ensouled Inchoroi to the population of Earwa would be counterintuitive.

However, we have also seen that the Inchies have the ability to use sorcery. In TTT Maithanet reveals that the skin spy who infiltrated the Mandate was able to use sorcery because it had a soul, and that would suggest that only ensouled beings can use sorcery. It has been established many times that Aurang can use magic, and suggested that Aurax can as well.

So what does everyone think? Are the Inchoroi ensouled?

26
The Unholy Consult / Re: Kosoter
« on: July 31, 2017, 12:44:35 am »
Yeah i also thought that Kosotor was the other head. Especially after seeing that comment.

I think it will to do with soul swapping or implanting souls into another body, using decapitatants. I guess it was no mistake that Sarl cut his head off.

That sounds about right. There's no way that Kosoter being beheaded was just a coincidence, and after what we learned in TUC with malowebie still being "alive" after his beheading, it seems that Kellhus was using some sort of soul trapping. I wonder what his part will be in TNG. I'd love to see him return as some Uber ciphrang

27
The Unholy Consult / [TUC Spoilers] Kosoter
« on: July 30, 2017, 10:45:57 pm »
I remember seeing a comment from Bakker on Westeros where he said something along the lines of "we haven't seen the last of Kosoter". This was pre TUC, and after reading that I had figured that Kosoter would play a role in TUC, and had assumed he was the other decapitant. But after finishing the book, this seems unlikely. Any thoughts on how Kosoter will play a role in TNG? I really hope to see more of him, he was an intriguing character

[EDIT Madness: Title.]

28
The Unholy Consult / Re: Ranking the books after TUC
« on: July 30, 2017, 07:41:15 am »
It was very difficult to rank because PON is such a different series than TAE, but I'll never forget the battle for Shimeh at the end of TTT, and the ending of that book was phenomenonal. But the journey to the coffers was probably my favorite arc in TAE. But it's do hard to decide when each book is near perfect

29
The Unholy Consult / [TUC Spoilers] Ranking the books after TUC
« on: July 30, 2017, 02:47:15 am »
Hi all, first time poster, long time lurker. After finishing TUC, I re-read the entire series and decided I would rank the books in order of favorite to least favorite. Would love to read everyone else's ranking!
1.TTT
2.WLW
3.TUC
4.TDTCB
5.TWP
6.TGO
7.TJE

[Wilshire Edit: Added [TUC Spoilers] tag to title.]

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