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QuoteThe attempt to bend the Holy War to Nansur interests had been a daring gambit, they all agreed, but so long as the brilliant Conphas marched with them, the Emperor might still succeed. Conphas. A man like a God. A true child of Kyraneas, or even Cenei—of the old blood. How could he fail to make the Holy War his own? “Think of it!” they cried. “The Old Empire restored!” And they raised yet another toast to their ancient nation.- The Darkness That Comes Before, chapter 19.
Fwiw, I interpret the 'oar' as the horde controlled by Mog also. They power and steer the Apocalypse as the no-god's tool and here are used to spank the Ordeal. There is no need for Bakker to invent yet another term for Tsuramah, but there is a need to differentiate the Horde from the Oar as a controlled swarm of sranc.The Horde of the No-God is generally referred to as the Horde of the No-God (actually, has another name ever been used?). The Oars, on the other hand, are alluded to as being parts of the Ark. For example, here:Quote from: R. Scott Bakker, "The Unholy Consult", Chapter Fourteen, "Golgotterath"The Horns reared impossible, commanding all, the two great Oars of the Ark goring the belly of the sky.
Mediocre episode. The final scene was amazing. The dialogue wasn't as bad as it can get, but nothing special otherwise.
Hello everyone!
Before I learned of Bakker through fellow Watcher Brinn (goes by another name here), it was easier to feel discouraged about working on a philosophical epic fantasy novel for the past 20 years, in virtual obscurity. As Tolkien has said of his own work, my tale grew in the telling. Now it has expanded into at least 6 books, the first of which will need to be broken into 2 or 3, depending on how much I can whittle down the 400,000 words I've got for book 1 so far. Watching it grow has been not as much exhilarating as it is depressing. (Sorry, couldn't resist ... ... Madness gets it.)
After learning about Bakker's experiences, I've been encouraged by his example. Inexplicably, there appears to be an audience out there for unabashedly philosophical, thought-provoking fantasy! Who would have guessed? You crazy fuckers rock. I've only been a lurker for a few weeks, so I'm looking forward to getting to know everyone.
Until the disappointing TUC, I was having difficulty deciding if Bakker was my 1st or 3rd choice for favorite fantasy author (you can probably guess the other two ). I'm extremely impressed with his vision, prose, and intellectual rigor. I'm moved by his evocative, conflicted, and enigmatic characters. I'm jealous of the things he does that I could never do, but can't wait to show you all the things that are uniquely me.
It's a wonderful time, for fantasy authors and fans alike!
[Zarathustra" was taken. I'm a mirror of my Watch self here.]
I mean to say that I'm very confident that as soon as one's own life is at stake, of your own wife or daughter is raped and killed, one has no problem with morality, moralizing and clear moral choices.
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The question therefore is, why can't you apply that personal stake to others as well? Which is succinctly expressed in various religions as 'do not do to others what you do not want done to yourself' (paraphrasing a bit here).
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the dignity of our own life and that of others.
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- Both of these points lead to the recognition that our own life and that of others are not separate. Therefore, a basis for morality being relative is tenuous.
Defending yourself doesn't make it moral: ie, Hitler defended himself until he gave up. Does that justify his war because he knew if he lost that he'd be killed? I don't think it does.
Defending another doesn't make it moral: All war could be justified as defending your compatriots against the evil invaders.
I think people hold their own lives in high regard, but not those of others. See: war, or any other act of violence.
So, imo, your points point out only the disfunction of beliving in some type of objective morality: that self preservation is the only thing that 'morality' ever leads to. I'd rather not live in a world where "I" am the only thing that matters, justified by each persons personal sense of 'what is right'. There isn't objective morality that I've seen - I think if there was, then we'd all agree on it, certainly after thinking about it for 2000+ years.
As Winston Churchil said: The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Many forms of Government have been tried, and will be tried in this world of sin and woe. No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all-wise. Indeed it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time.…
Hi Ordealpeople
Since it come up in this thread & in lieu of starting a new one, anyone have any ideas how Kelmomas physically got into the Golden Room? I know it's been discussed the Serwë skinspy snatching him up some point, which I don't remember happening. Barring that, my assumption is he was trailing in Ajokis' footsteps, and can just move about Narindar-like because he's the No-God. Or something like that.