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Messages - greenshift

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The Unholy Consult / Re: Speculiction's What Comes Next!
« on: September 22, 2017, 08:36:25 pm »
The dreams of Seswatha are quite a strange thing to be honest. Part of his soul must be trapped in his mummified heart.

Like the Amiolas? Seswatha did wear the thing three times and I believe he commented that the information he learned was invaluable (don't recall the exact phrasing). Initially this 'information' comes across as being related to retrieving the Heron Spear, but perhaps it's true value was from some understanding of the principles of the Amiolas that allowed the creation of the Heart. Still unsure what all the implications would be if so...

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I'll add a vote for Nil’giccas (or any Nonman really). Living so long that you have no memory of love or happiness, being left only with anguish and despair, seems about as tragic as it gets. Oh and in this state you end up turning on your former allies and still have Damnation to look forward to after death. Proyas got off light in comparison. Very little sympathy for that guy. I think he got way less than he deserved for being such a presumptuous and pompous asshole.

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It's funny because though it's apparent that Ajokli seems to possess Cnaiur, I don't actually attribute that dialogue to Ajokli. I'm quibbly, of course - though as far as I'm concerned much less than others are with other thinkenearing and finagling.

Though, isn't it interesting that Kelmomas as No-God hanging above Ajokli exactly mirrors Ajokli's Idol above Kelmomas in TJE prologue?

I can see your stance on the Cnaiur dialogue (monologue?). He easily could have said and meant that himself and it would be consistent with both his character and speech that we've seen so far. After a quick browse through the relevant section, I think the speaker switches from Cnaiur -> Ajokli during the paragraph describing his horns appearing. That is also when the Sranc horde are described as starting to part away from him. Then very next line says he "roared with no human voice". Looks like as good a point as any for the point of full possession and a speaker switch.

And I hadn't considered the mirrored imagery with Kelmomas and the Ajokli idol, but I like that a lot. I had even reconsidered the idol scene after the No-God reveal, all I put together was that Ajokli would have had no clue Kelmomas was there talking to him! Just a beetle randomly losing legs and making circles (if he was paying attention to that at all).

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The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] (or maybe not) - The Daimos
« on: July 19, 2017, 08:55:24 pm »
I think it's as simple as 'Ajokli speaks in bold font.'

Don't we get examples of Kellhus doing seemingly magically acts without sorcery before the speech starts to use bold font? I don't have the book in front of me at the moment to confirm one way or the other. If so that would suggest that Ajokli was in control of Kellhus before we start seeing the bold font. Also, if the Golden room is invisible to the gods, then how would Ajokli be able to posses Kellhus without being able to observe him? As the Dunsult note he could not be seen there by the gods normally. This isn't a problem if we assume he has possessed Kellhus before he enters the room. The only other option I see is that Kellhus would somehow have needed to switch his own head with Ajokli's after being in the room without anyone noticing or commenting. I have a hard time believing that given the amount of scrutiny he is likely receiving at that time, unless...some sort of magical chicanery that we aren't privy to is at play which is somewhat unsatisfying.

And as I mentioned in earlier post, the description of a 'descending hunger' sounds A LOT like how Ajokli has been portrayed so far (raiding the granary and all). The bold font hadn't started at that point and I very strongly suspect that was Ajokli talking.

I rule out Kellhus being on the Outside by the fact that Ajokli can not find him after the salting. If Kellhus was dead and on the Outside then Ajokli could see him and there is no reason for the Cnaiur possession. Even if we suppose Cnaiur was possessed by Gilgaol instead, then that still leaves the problem as to why he can't see Kellhus on the Outside.

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The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] Kellhus and future stories
« on: July 19, 2017, 08:01:52 pm »
I have to throw my hat in the 'Kellhus is not dead' camp with the explanation that he wasn't "wearing" his head at the time he was salted. Also with the outside chance that this was somewhat close to Kellhus's intended outcome.

While I don't have strong direct evidence, I feel a Cui Bono argument somewhat supports this. With Ajokli possessing Cnaiur we get insight that Ajokli doesn't know where Kellhus is. And Ajokli is pissed. Very pissed. Enough so that it appears Ajokli is now waging war against the No-God. With that in mind, who benefits from this outcome? Especially if you think that the No-God rising again is inevitable.

That line of thinking had me consider that the Kellhus "illusion" obfuscating the No-God initially could have been Kellhus's doing all along. This would be to trick Ajokli into thinking he is the No-God so that Ajokli would wage war against it. Although this conflicts with what I feel is a more supported argument that the illusion was from the Dunsult (foreshadowed by the Shauriatas 'hologram') but I guess that could be a red herring. And I also can't remember anything suggesting Kellhus would have the ability to create such an illusion which would be another strike against it (unless it's similar enough to how a sorcerer can alter dreams, except this requires it for EVERYONE watching). It also starts to get a little too far into the "Kellhus is in complete control" field for my tastes. I do think the guy is fallible, but maybe this isn't an example of his failure? Surely he's done extensive planning for this moment, no? Although I'm not sure how he could easily plot against Ajokli while also being somewhat possessed by him...so that is another potential problem with this hypothesis. Maybe when his own head is disconnected from his own body he can plot without Ajokli being aware?

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The Unholy Consult / Re: [TUC Spoilers] (or maybe not) - The Daimos
« on: July 19, 2017, 05:31:17 pm »
Madness's post hit on an something that I had been wondering about (enough so that I finally registered to post).

After the Ajokli reveal with Kellhus I immediately reconsidered his dialogue with that in mind. To me it was clear that the "descending as a hunger" comment was how Ajokli perceived himself through the Inverse Fire, not Kellhus. That fits extremely well with how we've seen Ajokli described previously. As far as I'm concerned we don't know what Kellhus himself would see when looking into the IF. It seems a common opinion on this forum to attribute the above to Kellhus, but I feel that is mistaken and I've wondered why I haven't seen the Ajokli interpretation pushed more often.

And I'm probably getting a little off-topic (apologies), but I'm also curious if Kelmomas happened to look into the IF while he was in the Golden room and what he would see if he did. Presumably he wouldn't be affected the same as others? Considering how the No-God is invisible to the Outside, he wouldn't see himself suffering damnation, correct? If not, then what would he see? Also, would Samarmas still inhabiting Kelmomas change this somehow? If there are two souls in a body then what would that person see in the IF (especially if one of the two is the No-God)? Not sure if we'll ever see this one answered or if its even relevant, just something I was debating with myself.

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