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Messages - sciborg2

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1141
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: What is the No God?
« on: August 26, 2013, 03:28:55 pm »
I think it's brilliant Sci!

Thanks!

I don't think it's 100% accurate, but I do think there are connections between the No-God, the God, and paradox.

Mimara says only souls can apprehend paradox.

The wiki says there is a connection between chorae, and the Uroborian Circle Akka was trapped in by the SS. [Why I associate the "Endless Hunger" with a snake eating its tail.]

Mimara feels something that appears to be the God when she looks into the chorae with her Judging Eye.

The Aporos was actually banned before they made Chorae. Was it simply because they broke the power of sorcery? Or because the Aporetic sorcerers discovered something about reality that upset the assumed natural order the Nonmen took for granted?

I want to say the Aporetics found the divinity Mimara seems to have experienced by looking into the chorae, but it's hard for me to believe anyone touched by Heaven would side with the Inchoroi.

1142
Just to be sure, this isn't about the 4X game Endless Space right?
I might check this out later when I'm not at work.

The specific game isn't. But my understanding of the premise is a ship from the Endless Space setting crashes into the Endless Setting fantasy world.

Just made me think of the Inchie Bros landing on Earwa.

1143
The Endless games are a sci/fantasy mashup:

Dungeon Of The Endless

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The endless endlessness, it never ends! In the beginning, there was Endless Space, and it was endlessly space-y. Recently, we also told you of Endless Legend, which is another 4X strategy set in the same universe, only all fantasy-fied. But let’s not forget about Dungeon of the Endless...

...The game itself is thematic and mechanical smoothie – a sumptuously blended fusion of sci-fi and fantasy, roguelike and tower defense. You’ll be able to pick from 30 different characters, all of whom were prisoners before their jail barge careened into Planet Randomized Doom in the General Unpleasantness Sector. You’ll meet other characters too, and they might give you a helping hand, or perhaps they’ll grip your frayed fingers just long enough to put a space knife between your ribs.

1144
This actually could explain the five nations being of different races but existing on the same continent.

It's still unknown to what extent evolution played a part on Earwa, but if you had transplanted humans from different nations that might help explain things.

1145
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: The Ground, the Void and the Outside.
« on: August 24, 2013, 04:04:19 pm »
I'm sort of fascinated of how Cnaiur describes the Mansion as a "Great Inversion of Ground" and particularly how that might relate to the Scylvendi's cultural take on Ground...

Perhaps tunnels forcing one toward certain destinations inverting the trackless Steppe?

Would fit Cnaiur's whole arc, which is him always trying to forge new tracks for himself but always being trapped in the machinations of the Dunyain.

1146
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: What is the No God?
« on: August 24, 2013, 04:00:59 pm »
Throwing my Ouroboros theory into the ring. Will subsequently post some of the comments/discussion from Westeros, but you can read some of that here:

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/78108-the-unholy-consult-previews-and-speculation/page__st__380#entry4213686

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On another note, going back to the idea of God/No-God as states of the same entity, could the No-God simply be the God dragged into a reality where one is forced to acccept the arrow of time?

The No-God asks "what do you see?" and "what am I?" The notion of seeing reminds [me] of Calasso's interpretation of Hinduism focusing on the idea of two beings in the Mind - the mind that acts and the mind that watches. Or as Bakker put it, the "watcher and watch[ed]" that anchors sorcery.

What if the God, outside of time, has no need for origin or ending, a perfect circle? Dragged into linear time the God now is aware that thoughts follow thoughts. The circle is now an ouroboros, serenity replaced by an obsession to catch the origin of one's own thinking.

The Circle dreams and we get creation. The Ouroboros metaphorically devours itself and we get the Angel of Endless hunger.

I think there are hints pointing in this direction:

In TWP, Akka is trapped in an Uroborian Circle. This prevents him from utilizing sorcery. It negates his ability to grasp the clarity of meaning necessary for sorcery. What would happen if the God was in similar straits?

After being possessed by Aurang in TTT, Esmi worries about the things she hungered for. Kellhus assures her those weren't her desires, she merely suffered them. Esmi asks "Then how does any desire belong to me?" as she suddenly becomes aware that desire's origin lies outside the purview of conscious thought.

In the same book, IIRC Moe worries that Kellhus is touched by the No-God. Kellhus says "Thoughts come. I know they are not my own." Yet IIRC TDTCB begins with [a] quote that notes thoughts [always] come of their own volition, intruding onto the conscious mind.

Dunyain, as Inri notes to Maitha, are always reflecting, always trying to catch the origin of their thoughts. Cnauir notes the Dunyain are like sharks, always swimming toward the goal. The way he describes [Kellhus] calls back to the idea of endless hunger.

Seswatha notes that the circuit of watcher and watched is the foundation of all sorcery. This would mean this circuit fixes meaning, and when this circuit is broken presumably sorcery fails. When the God fails to apprehend Its own perfection, then Its magic - the entirety of the onta - fails. [Its only hope is to be recognized by the watchers, the shards of Itself which are the souls of men. This is why it demand-begs through the unsouled -sranc, bashrag, wraccu - to know what the ensouled see.]

1147
The Warrior-Prophet / Re: Kellhus and the No-God
« on: August 24, 2013, 03:33:31 pm »
Looking at the dream, I'm reminded of the comic Slo Wave where the artist illustrated people's dreams and Basso's dream journals.

It's a jumble of various things, possible futures mixed in with symbols form the past.

So the figure at the base of the tree could merely be symbolic of the No-God rather than any kind of revelation about Its nature.

I didn't think of the silhouettes as the horns of the Ark, I figured they were actual people but I think you're more likely to be right.

The underground tunnels I thought were the Nonmen tunnels, not those of the Ark, but the ones in the dream probably represent both.

What's interesting is the part how multiples worlds are apparently terrified of the No-God. Was this something the Inchies tried on other worlds but failed? Because it seems from the Bakker writing we have so far that Shae helped conceive the No-God?

1148
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: False Prophecy
« on: August 23, 2013, 05:39:42 pm »
What is Earwa's Arrow of Time and how does it point? I think defining this is crucial to this discussion.

I don't know...even if it's circular or subject to some backward causality those living within the flow of time don't seem to have a way to tell false and true prophecies apart.

I suppose one technique to differentiate is to examine the qualities of the varied Prophet's souls - but it seems to me the Inchie Bros are just fanatics who've bet too much on things turning out the way they hope/need them to.

1149
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: Weapons of Animata
« on: August 23, 2013, 05:23:22 pm »
But if Shae doesn't control his motion, is that throwing shanks to the wolf of my argument? If he has to fall continuously in a circular fashion he's going to be jumping from corpse to corpse.

As for Synthese, I do think it might be possible for Shae and other Consult magi to pilot one but I have my doubts.

I'm also not sure if a Synthese dying results in the death of the soul piloting it. Would Aurang pilot one if such was the case? We're talking about a being that is absolutely terrified of dying, so I'd think he'd find a lackey to do so if his soul was in danger of leaving Earwa.

1150
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: The Ground, the Void and the Outside.
« on: August 23, 2013, 06:04:43 am »
@Madness:

I'm trying to remember what we talked about regarding the Topos. Did we try to tie in the Aporetic (and possibly Daimotic) Quya?

I think the Nonmen at first were keeping slaves in terrible conditions and then slowly realized what a Topos was and what it meant.

Yet why were they so determined to worship between the gods, when bowing to the Hundred would have save many more of their [souls] trials.

1151
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: False Prophecy
« on: August 23, 2013, 05:57:39 am »
I don't doubt the metaphysics of Earwa lends itself to Prophecy, but how could one living under Earwa's arrow of time sort out what will happen in the future?

Seems to me the difference between true and false prophecies is preference. Mimara may have something to do with the salvation/damnation mechanics, something the Inchies don't want to happee, so to comfort themselves they say the prophecy involving her is false.

Of course, if they think she's part of a false prophecy, why not have the skin-spy killer her? Seems like she may be a contingency, or perhaps trapping a woman with the Judging Eye into the Carapace is what makes a No-God....which explains why the Consult had to wait all this tine...

1152
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: Moenghus the Elder's (Other) Children
« on: August 23, 2013, 05:42:47 am »
Could Saccarees be a child of Big Moe?

Or is he too old?

1153
The White-Luck Warrior / Re: Weapons of Animata
« on: August 23, 2013, 04:39:31 am »
I figure since Shae will have a puppet army of empty vessels, making him more of less invincible as he jumps out of a corpse before its destroyed. Undefinable army of undead zombie sorcerers.

I got the feeling Shae has to leap from body to body constantly, and that this has to be done via the circle of living elderly amputees.

So given the fragility of that procedure I can't see him using his immortalility as a weapon in the manner you describe.

1154
Philosophy & Science / Re: Rupert Sheldrake
« on: August 23, 2013, 04:03:25 am »
As per my understanding his data is questionable.

Which is not to say that he's a fraud, only that you can look at data for things like "Dogs Knowing Owners are coming home." and interpret it as proof of Psi or proof of nothing.


1155
A discussion of alien civilizations let do [lead to] someone mentioning this when I suggested the SA is why we'v not heard from any one else in the galaxy:

Desire Modification: the ultimate technology

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However, not everyone will end up in the same cul-de-sac. The resultant "clades" of humans will be very, very different from each other, much more different than people are now. This will make human interaction very weird. In fact, in a sci-fi story I'm writing, I refer to the rapid adoption of d-mod as "The Weirdening", and I think the Weirdening would (will?) be even weirder and more important and less predictable than the "Singularity".

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However, after all this talk of zombie slaves and Weirdenings, I should note that I personally think that d-mod will be pretty benign. Most people just want to be happier, more motivated, kinder versions of the people they already are. Although we could conceivably become a planet of bizarre posthumans, I think the more likely outcome is that we'll end up pretty close to where we started. But the extra life satisfaction that we'll get from d-mod, even so, will represent a bigger a boost to utility and happiness than any technology before or after. It will put the lie to the old (and wrong) idea that technology doesn't change human nature.

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