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Of course, there is the possibility that Kellhus himself somehow went back and exterminated all the remaining Dunyain, but logistically that seems improbable.

Why? Seems maybe a couple of hours work?

Once he gets there, sure.  But I seem to recall Kellhus being utterly exhausted just "translocating" his way back to Momemn from Sakarpus.  To go from Momemn to Ishual then back?  Possible, but I think improbable.

Another question: just how could Achamian dream of being Nau-Cayuti?  Any conjectures?

Go to a place near Ishual, take a nap, maybe a small vacation (why not? hes the god damn emperor, he earned it). Blow up Ishual with some seriously awesome meta-gnosis badassery, take nap number 2. Skip like a stone back to esmi's bed chambers, get some more "work" done (if ya know what i mean). Take 3rd nap.

A few days out of the Empire, who gives a crap? I guarantee no one has the authority to call him out for missing a few meetings.

Don't forget that he also appeared on the battlefield discussed above, to rescue the surviving schoolmen. He warps in with his ball of blue light and immediately starts blowing up shit. Ground exploding and all that.
Or when he shows up at the end of TTT and wipes out the Cishi.
How many jumps away was the army? More than one sure, like in TTT, but not as many as half way around the world (like earlier when he makes that Yatwer lady piss herself).

regarding the inutteral thing, Achamian was able to "hand" an inutteral off to Mimara with the "ball of light"

This was in Cil right? He gave here the ball of light and told her to run back to the rest of the skin eaters.
He didn't really give her the innuteral, she just held onto the spell. She still has no mark, so she did not actually do any magic. And was she able to control it (turn it off) or was Akka the one who still really had control over it? I cannot recall this.

Also, remember throughout Cil how much Akka whined about maintaining magic for long periods of time.
I can't imagine that being handed a spell way outside of your grasp would be as easy as ignoring a bar of heaven, even for the grandmaster. Then you suggest to compound this with the latent use of meta-gnostic spells. It wouldnt be like flipping a switch on and off with some spiffy wards. He would certainly be under some extreme internal stress if nothing else, which would probably make him irritable and not so grand and wonderful

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Amidst all the speculations and half conjectures (our degraded version of the Probability Trance  ), I just like to bring the discussion back to the original post for a moment -- it's a marvel just how well-written that little piece of nightmare is.

Just picture it in your mind, if you dare:

A naked young man, kneeling, arms tied in chains stretching behind him, straining upward with all his might, mouth open and roaring with his face reaching upward; meanwhile, ten half-rotted leering sacks of flesh surrounding him, cackling, murmuring, their half-crazed voices endlessly looping around the circle; all the while, a golden disc carries them ever upward toward some unknownable hell...

It's difficult not to sound like a fanboy.  But man how I love this stuff!

[What Came Before]

+1 :ugeek:

I do not have set goatee.

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Its hard not to digress, but I do suppose most of the discussions should be done elsewhere. Thanks madness for making new threads for us = ). Keeps the debates separated and more easily followed.

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does anyone know when this is coming out i cant wait any longer!

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My hopes are January, 2013, until I hear otherwise and assuming I survive the Mayan Apocalypse (which is misdated and cyclical regardless ).

Welcome to the Second Apocalypse, Saubon123.

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Mayan Apocalypse (which is misdated and cyclical regardless ).

Oh?, my understanding was it's the 21st of December 2012.
Why do you say it’s misdated Madness?

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Lol, apologies. I meant my hopes are that TUC will come out January, 2013.

The current estimate of the Mayan Apocalypse, which is simply one of many calculations, is indeed the 21st of December this year. It's just that the historical evidence and concurrent time measurements aren't ample for that specific date. More likely, the near-date of sociologically motivated phenomenon - something we embody as a social or cultural body.

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Madness, January 2013 would be cool but since he has not yet finished writing the book i think it is out of the question.WLW took about 10 months between finishing the book and actual publication so IF he is over until December i think we will have it in our hands around fall 2013.

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Yeah - Sadly, I think the absolute best-case-scenario is something like June of 2013 with later in the year more likely.  There are few books I've ever looked forward to so much.  The stakes are pretty damn high.  I've been captivated by this series, but so much has remained unrevealed, and so much is likely to finally be revealed in TUC.

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Honestly, I just put a date on it and shove it in a box in the back of my mind. I got enough books that aren't Bakker to read, not to mention the time I spend rereading and exploring his.

First half of the new year, I think, is par for the course. I bought TJE Janurary '09 and WLW February '11.

We don't have any idea where Bakker is really at with the "finished product of the book." One comment elicited a word count on TPB over the past couple weeks but who knows, right?!

But yes, I share in the excitement... Bakker's books usually make my skull feel ripped open .

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Hi everyone. English is not my language so I hope you'll forget any mistake. I think this novel is a masterpiece, but when I come to recommend it, many people say it's too difficult/complicated. It's frustrating not being able to talk about it with others. So I ended up here.

Anyway, for this topic is about the Akka Chapter in TUC, I too was overwhelmed by the image of the wheel of old amputees speaking the voice of Shae (this short form makes me think about some whore and some dwarf). This Scott keeps on surprising us with awesome ideas.

I think that althoug Ishual is destroyed, the thousand thousand halls is another story. Maybe there are dunyains left in there. More likely there are not, but who knows?

The idea someone mentioned about Moenghus destroying Ishual after Kellhus departure seems unlikely to me, since Moenghus rank as Cishaurim and his activity (Skauras messenger, etc.) in that time must have been a complication when he planned the "Ishual trip".

The "How is he doing?" was hilarious; remind me, not whitout nostalgy, of that far far time when all was laughter between Achamian, Kellhus, Esmenet and Xinemus... when we all were so innocent, listening to the tales by the fire, and jokes like "the water is cold" ... "and deep", or the "eyes like a monkey's ass" of one of Xin soldiers.

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Welcome, Feanor.

What language did you read PON in originally?

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No no, I did read it in english. For two reasons: in general, I prefer to read novels in its original language (when it´s english; I don´t know that much of other languages). And in particular, Prince of Nothing translation to spanish is very bad. And there is no translation of The Aspect Emperor at all, only PoN.

I read twice each book in english (the first five, I mean), and then I get the spanish edition of the first three and read them once.

Italic parts on TWLW though... I read them several times (same as the SEAL rising from the screwdriver pit at the end of TJE (sea mammal or sigil?). This Bakker really makes me squeeze my brains...

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Very cool. Too bad that the Aspect-Emperor isn't in spanish.

Sigil in the Judging Eye.

Yes, we are all wondering about the italics in TWLW .