What's up with the "Second" Inverse Fire

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SmilerLoki

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« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2021, 05:03:31 am »
This seems to be about things different - and perhaps more - than simply Hell.

sciborg2

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« Reply #16 on: May 05, 2021, 03:17:42 pm »
This seems to be about things different - and perhaps more - than simply Hell.

Definitely - I don't the latter work has any hints of being an accurate picture of Hell, rather it has something to do with the true nature of God perhaps...maybe the artwork reflects what Mimara sees through the Chorae?

H

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« Reply #17 on: May 05, 2021, 03:25:01 pm »
Yeah, to me that entry speaks more to this line, from the epigraph to The False Sun:

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For I have seen the virtuous in Hell and the wicked in Heaven. And I swear to you, brother, the scream you hear in the one and the sigh you hear in the other sound the same.

Which is a rephrase, in a way, to a line from Jacob's Ladder, which is a sort of recapitulating of Meister Eckhart, I think.

To use vague, bullshit Hegelian terms that I can't qualify because they are too vague and I am not articulate enough to really formalize my loose associations, I think we could imagine the Outside as a sort of concretization of the ethical realm and the soul as the concretization of the ethical substance.

From the Phenomenology of Spirit:
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349. If we take this goal—and this is the Notion which for us has already appeared on the scene—in its reality, viz. the self-consciousness that is recognized and acknowledged, and which has its own self-certainty in the other free self-consciousness, and possesses its truth precisely in that ‘other’; in other words, if we look on this still inner Spirit as Substance that has already advanced to the stage of having an outer existence, then in this Notion there is disclosed the realm of ethical life. For this is nothing else than the absolute spiritual unity of the essence of individuals in their independent actual existence; it is an intrinsically universal self-consciousness that takes itself to be actual in another consciousness, in such wise that this has complete independence, or is looked on as a Thing, and it is precisely therein that the universal self-consciousness is aware of its unity with it, and only in this unity with this objective being is it self-consciousness. This ethical Substance, taken in its abstract universality, is only law in the form of thought; but it is no less immediately actual self-consciousness, or it is custom. The single individual consciousness, conversely, is only this existent unit in so far as it is aware of the universal consciousness in its individuality as its own being, since what it does and is, is the universal custom.

Now, everyone is asking, what?  Here is the translator's note on the paragraph:
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349. The stage of self-consciousness towards which we are now moving is essentially ethical, governed by unwritten laws and social customs, a framework within which the individual lives and moves, and from which he does not think to disassociate himself.

But again, you likely ask, what?  The thing is, I think the point is far, far less of a "what does that mean exactly" and far more of "how can we imagine these terms in an Eärwan manner."

In other words, Eärwa can be a place where we ask, what happens if an "ethical realm" isn't just a notion, thought, concept or idea, but an actual place?  What if ethical substance isn't just a term to describe an abstract notion, but literal Substance?  I think there is a lot more, because there is also the manner in which the soul, in that glossary entry, is fashioned as the sort of unobserved observer which is a whole other can of worms.

OK, I am raving a little bit here with my loose associations...
I am a warrior of ages, Anasurimbor. . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury. -Cet'ingira

sciborg2

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« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2021, 03:58:21 pm »
Yeah it all gets wonky once you have a world like Earwa - itself in the Bakkerverse - where stuff like breeding and evolution work similarly but not exactly like they do here, and where a Post-Singularity Civilization can scientifically prove its own damnation.

What is artistic creativity in such an Idealist-we-are-all-One world? What are myths in a world where gods are not just real but seemingly suffused into creation in some sort of elemental way?

When an artist is inspired, does something Divine move through them? Something clairvoyant?
« Last Edit: May 05, 2021, 04:00:21 pm by sciborg2 »