[Wilshire]

Maybe, but again, I do believe Serwe and friends where on the far side of the mountains.

[Madness]

So attacks which destroyed a pair of ruins?

[SkiesOfAzel]

Asking who destroyed the monastery is like asking who killed JFK. I mean who wouldn't want them dead. The Consult has motive, Kellhus has motive, hell even the Gods have motive. It's just a matter of who got there first. My money is on Kellhus.

[Somnambulist]

Asking who destroyed the monastery is like asking who killed JFK. I mean who wouldn't want them dead. The Consult has motive, Kellhus has motive, hell even the Gods have motive. It's just a matter of who got there first. My money is on Kellhus.

Agreed.  While Kel may have had designs for the children of the dunyain (i.e., to train for whatever purposes he concocted), I think all the 'conditioned' adults would have been too much of a headache for him to try to bring around to his cause.  He had to eliminate that threat.  Also, I just don't buy the Wutteat option.  Dead, blind, recently torn up by a Quya and a War Cant Master...  sure, I think he has the power to do something like that, but why would he?  And if a blind dragon could find Ishual...  there's a joke in there somewhere.

[Wilshire]

And if a blind dragon could find Ishual...  there's a joke in there somewhere.

 

But there is so much irony if Wutteat managed to find them when the consult have been freaking out for the better part of 30 years trying to find the nest to no avail.

[Madness]

Perhaps, there is simply a bunch of back story we don't know about at this point.

For instance, SOA got me thinking that Kellhus might certainly leave a strange mark if he is another Titirga. I actually don't really believe anymore, if I did, that Kellhus would possibly seek out the Dunyain just to destroy them. Kellhus entered a world ruled by worldborn - any Dunyain who emerges from Ishual doesn't stand a chance.

EDIT:

To add, I'm still all about Wutteat destroying Ishual. I'm not sure blind means blind in Earwa and torching Ishual would take nothing of Wutteat's strength. He did just lose a fight to a Quya and a Wizard... I guess... so maybe he just wanted to spaz and destroy something on his way back to Golgotterath.

[mrganondorf]

NOT WUTTEAT!!!  Derived can't shit without permission!  Dragon W is another lying liar who works the will of his masters!

Kellhus leave a mark like the way Titirga's looked?  If anyone can manipulate the appearance of a residual mark, leave it to a dunyain.

Akka is going to find gnosis marks everywhere.  Not from Kellhus--the other dunyain decided not to tell him, they never did abandon sorcery.  They've been perfecting it for 2000 years.

[Madness]

According to the story, Wutteat is the only Wracu who isn't derived.

Kellhus could leave a mark that is different, that is all I wanted to imply. Not necessarily "like Titirga" - which actually means nothing because we never saw how exactly his sorcery cutting the world was any different from the Gnosis.

[mrganondorf]

Personalized destruction, by Kellhus.

Everyone will know it when he's destroyed your castle.

[SkiesOfAzel]

Wutteat would be more fun, because in this way Aka would be responsible for the destruction of the answers he seeks, but i vote for Kellhus because what makes him what he is that he leaves nothing to chance. The Dunyain are just to dangerous to be left breathing. 

[mrganondorf]

oooohhhh, I hadn't thought of Ishual as freshly destroyed.  Akka > Wutteat > No Ishual.  Like.

As far as Kellhus regarding the Dunyain as too dangerous to be left behind:

1) Really want to see how far Bakker is going with the Plato's Republic thing in that the guardians/rulers are absolutely conditioned to act in the interest of the city.

2) I suspect that the dunyain and/or old moe have previously calculated how dangerous it was to let kellhus out

[Wilshire]

+1 Akka causing his own misfortune.

MG, if the anyone tried to calculate how dangerous Kellhus was before he left, I submit that they were wrong. I don't think the Dunyain in Ishual thought he would make it to Shimeh, and I think Moe thought he could use him as his pawn. Whatever Kellhus has become, I don't think anyone thought he would go so far.

[mrganondorf]

If they didn't think he'd be able to complete the mission, then surely they sent contingencies...

I'm just peddling the unwarranted theory that K never stopped being someone's pawn!    I bet TUC ends with revelations of who and the near fulfillment of their designs then the happening of shit no one expected.

I'm going to go on with it even if its not in TUC--dunyain successfully disenchanted the world and ages later conditioned a fantasy writer to tell their story to begin preparing the world for their coming.

[SkiesOfAzel]

+1 Akka causing his own misfortune.

MG, if the anyone tried to calculate how dangerous Kellhus was before he left, I submit that they were wrong. I don't think the Dunyain in Ishual thought he would make it to Shimeh, and I think Moe thought he could use him as his pawn. Whatever Kellhus has become, I don't think anyone thought he would go so far.

I believe they couldn't predict what Kellhus would become because their causality chains didn't factor the outside influence when predicting effects. They had no reason to believe that Kellhus would fail, or become a threat to them.

[EDIT]
Causing your own misfortune like Aka is a classic example of a feedback loop which humans mistakenly attribute to bad luck. Example:
You have an important appointment at work -> you don't want to be late -> you drive fast -> the police stops you for a speed limit violation -> you get delayed -> you miss the appointment.

[Madness]

oooohhhh, I hadn't thought of Ishual as freshly destroyed.  Akka > Wutteat > No Ishual.  Like.

As far as Kellhus regarding the Dunyain as too dangerous to be left behind:

1) Really want to see how far Bakker is going with the Plato's Republic thing in that the guardians/rulers are absolutely conditioned to act in the interest of the city.

Only the producers and the guardians are conditioned to act in the interest of the city. And I don't think we've yet seen the Philosopher-Kings/Queens of the Dunyain yet (unless we've glimpsed their expressivelessness in the Pragma).

+1 Akka causing his own misfortune.

MG, if the anyone tried to calculate how dangerous Kellhus was before he left, I submit that they were wrong. I don't think the Dunyain in Ishual thought he would make it to Shimeh, and I think Moe thought he could use him as his pawn. Whatever Kellhus has become, I don't think anyone thought he would go so far.

Dunyain Nostradamus knew. The next unopened missive reminds the Dunyain of folly. Gall. I really want there to be Dunyain Nostradamus.

[EDIT]
Causing your own misfortune like Aka is a classic example of a feedback loop which humans mistakenly attribute to bad luck. Example:
You have an important appointment at work -> you don't want to be late -> you drive fast -> the police stops you for a speed limit violation -> you get delayed -> you miss the appointment.

+1