[What Came Before]

I believe lockesnow used the word elite, Curethan, and I was simply making a statement - I don't necessarily think the accusation was leveled at anyone in particular, lockesnow just seemed to be drawing our attentions to possibilities of implicit attitude.

Lol, +1, Callan. Fuck that noise .

[What Came Before]

Yes, Madness is correct. I was more concerned with the implicit in-group self-congratulation going on than with leveling any sort of accusation.

I don't think these books are very hard.  my scifi journey took me through The hobbit, Star Wars EU, Dune, Lord of the Rings, Anne McCaffrey, Orson Scott Card, Robin Hobb & GRRM (found them at the same time) and Bakker.  Bakker seems of a piece with these, with more emphasis on the consequences of metaphysics than most speculative fiction (other than Dune).  That's about it, for genre, for me. So in my evaluation, I don't really see a need to promote tiers of understanding in my recommendations, because to me it's already such a small field that there's not much point in distinguishing.  Kellhus and Ender are very--VERY--similar, the former undermines the darker implications of what the latter might really be like.  Kennitt and Conphas are very similar.  Bakker seems to have situated himself squarely within the genre tropes, from my perspective, and I think it can just be picked up and read by most readers--the hardest part is not the world building or the metaphysics or the philosophy but the NAMES.    Granted, I'm particularly weak at names, I've been posting on Westeros for twelve years and I still can't spell Danaerys right.  Likeable characters are another consideration, but the problem there is that Bakker is never content to just have a Tyrion or an Arya character, he's got to constantly undermine the character for the reader; Bakker would never have Tyrion enjoy the company of whores because they'll tolerate his appearance (and his Tysha backstory), Bakker would have Tyrion enjoy raping whores (without thinking of it as rape, but so the reader can't mistake that its rape) because it's Tyrion's way of getting revenge on the whole female gender.  Martin allows the reader to empathize with Tyrion's perspective while Bakker twists the reader's perspective towards judging and condemning the character or towards participating in the character's self deceptions and crimes--I think sometimes that Bakker views empathy as an especial form of crime that should be stamped out and eradicated, a delusion that should not be tolerated.

[What Came Before]

Not seeing this apparent "self-congratulation" anywhere. This is probably the chillest board I've ever had the good fortune to find, and it honestly kind of bums me out there's a perception of Bakker fans as insular and circle-jerky. I will readily admit I may have contributed to that a bit in this thread, but only in reaction to what SATX's perceived as fanboyish tendencies. This is the only internet fandom that I know of that thoughtfully engages the source material and doesn't devolve into sexualization of its characters or other creepy things. I fully realize these are biases speaking, though. The internet has broken me.


it's me


im teh butthurt fanboy in the OP

[What Came Before]

Lol. I appreciate you, bbaztek.

We walk a fine line... Especially, with our tendencies to endlessly question . There's a comfort in ignorance, and as we (Bakker fans) consciously seek to undermine such tendencies, specifically in our selves, others find us abhorrent - as we mark the loss of comfort?

Cheeky guesses.

I mean, I could bore posters/readers for hours with evidence of ingroup/outgroup homogeneity, group attribution errors, etc, ad nauseum...

[Madness]

Dissemination Point: Local Coffee Shop's Leave One, Take One book shelf.
Drop Date: Aug 19/13
Book: The Darkness That Comes Before
Taken Before: Aug 21/13

Lol - I have too many copies of TDTCB . Next I think I'll leave Disciple.

[Wilshire]

Nice. I finally saw another Bakker book at Half Price Books.  It was WLW. I've seen 2 neuropath's, 2 DotD, and several of PON pass through there. Don't know if I'll be back there any time soon since I just moved, but hopefully that one gets moved.

[Garet Jax]

Dissemination Point: Local Coffee Shop's Leave One, Take One book shelf.
Drop Date: Aug 19/13
Book: The Darkness That Comes Before
Taken Before: Aug 21/13

Lol - I have too many copies of TDTCB . Next I think I'll leave Disciple.

What book did you end up taking off the shelf?  Inquiring mind(s) would like to know.

[Madness]

Nice. I finally saw another Bakker book at Half Price Books.  It was WLW. I've seen 2 neuropath's, 2 DotD, and several of PON pass through there. Don't know if I'll be back there any time soon since I just moved, but hopefully that one gets moved.

Half Price Books is a used bookstore chain in Americaland?

Dissemination Point: Local Coffee Shop's Leave One, Take One book shelf.
Drop Date: Aug 19/13
Book: The Darkness That Comes Before
Taken Before: Aug 21/13

Lol - I have too many copies of TDTCB . Next I think I'll leave Disciple.

What book did you end up taking off the shelf?  Inquiring mind(s) would like to know.

I just left one because I'm fucked up like that . Though I did read something, in perusal, called The Canadian Establishment, which read like standard, well-researched, not-so conspiracy fare.

[Baztek]

Anyone know if they still sell copies of WLW with this cover anywhere? or at least a larger version of the cover image? http://www.amazon.com/White-Luck-Warrior-Aspect-Emperor-Scott-Bakker/dp/B00AZ9FAF6/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1377198363&sr=1-1&keywords=white-luck+warrior

Ordered it through amazon and got a weird hodge-podge of the earlier WLW cover with the trademark black border.

[Wilshire]

Half Price Books is a used bookstore chain in Americaland?

Yup.

Anyone know if they still sell copies of WLW with this cover anywhere? or at least a larger version of the cover image? http://www.amazon.com/White-Luck-Warrior-Aspect-Emperor-Scott-Bakker/dp/B00AZ9FAF6/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1377198363&sr=1-1&keywords=white-luck+warrior

Ordered it through amazon and got a weird hodge-podge of the earlier WLW cover with the trademark black border.

I'd try Barnes and Noble, though I'm no expert. I'm pretty sure thats the cover my friend has on his, and he got all 5 books at the same time there... or at least I think he did.

[Madness]

Wow, that makes me sad for international buyers. Why wouldn't the US and UK publishers just make deals to carry the Canadian covers... so much better.

[Wilshire]

I saw a "little library" outside someone's house yesterday . It was a cedar box with glass face that had room for maybe 5-10 books. It had a note inside that said to take a book and leave on in its place. I should go back and slide TDTCB in there and see what happens...

Apparently its an official thing: http://www.littlefreelibrary.org/
A small 'hope restored in humanity' moment.

[Madness]

I should go back and slide TDTCB in there and see what happens...

You would change someone's life, Wilshire .

This little library seems an elegant way to disseminate knowledge.

[jamesA01]

At some point I might upload say the first chapter of the audiobook of TDTCB on youtube, would be good to have a little teaser there for the curious.

[Madness]

I think that might cross some reproduction legislation, neh?

Sometimes it saddens me that publishing advertisement experiences no innovation.