[TUC Spoilers] Esmenet the Angelic Ciphrang

  • 36 Replies
  • 9090 Views

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Wilshire

  • *
  • Administrator
  • Old Name
  • *****
  • Enshoiya
  • Posts: 5843
  • One of the other conditions of possibility
    • View Profile
« Reply #30 on: December 16, 2019, 04:19:42 pm »
I honestly thought of "someone's mind" when I read that and I hope that it's not. St. Elsewhere already did that and welp...it wasn't appreciated. "It was all a dream" is usually seen as a negative.

This quote/info, from Bakker, was described in more detail in that Stuff To Blow Your Mind podcast. Having listened to it, I did not get the feeling that "it was all a dream" is anywhere near what he was going for.

More like, as H said, the metaphysical structure of Earwa and the gods are like how the mind / conscious  / subconscious interact IRL (or some version of IRL insofar as Bakker thinks it works). Similar to how the Word of Earwa functions like our IRL biblical/holy-texts show the world - full of magic and vengeful gods.
One of the other conditions of possibility.

H

  • *
  • The Zero-Mod
  • Old Name
  • *****
  • The Honourable H
  • Posts: 2813
  • The Original No-God Apologist
    • View Profile
    • The Original No-God Apologist
« Reply #31 on: December 27, 2019, 03:23:51 pm »
More like, as H said, the metaphysical structure of Earwa and the gods are like how the mind / conscious  / subconscious interact IRL (or some version of IRL insofar as Bakker thinks it works). Similar to how the Word of Earwa functions like our IRL biblical/holy-texts show the world - full of magic and vengeful gods.

Well, that is a major part of the "project" in-itself, the notion of a world that "works" how we think/thought it worked.
I am a warrior of ages, Anasurimbor. . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury. -Cet'ingira

H

  • *
  • The Zero-Mod
  • Old Name
  • *****
  • The Honourable H
  • Posts: 2813
  • The Original No-God Apologist
    • View Profile
    • The Original No-God Apologist
« Reply #32 on: August 06, 2020, 04:40:22 pm »
Also, this is likely why the Nonmen consider the 100 as "Principles."  Because they are exactly that, conceptual "beings" (in more psychoanalytic terms, akin to Jung use, a "complex") of consciousness (self-consciousness).  They are anthropomorphic only because that is how consciousness (self-consciousness) experiences and describes them, a sort of narrative contrivance, externalized as a sort of psychological projection.

I want to follow this up a little bit with something I just came across in regard to "principles" and the 100.  I think it is a sort of Aristotelian concept here.

« Last Edit: August 06, 2020, 04:48:29 pm by H »
I am a warrior of ages, Anasurimbor. . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury. -Cet'ingira

H

  • *
  • The Zero-Mod
  • Old Name
  • *****
  • The Honourable H
  • Posts: 2813
  • The Original No-God Apologist
    • View Profile
    • The Original No-God Apologist
« Reply #33 on: August 06, 2020, 04:51:16 pm »
So, what is being said there?  How does it relate to the Nonman conception of the 100?

Well, the Nonman "gods" are the First Principles.  How do we explain, say, someone's behavior of deception?  By the First Principle of Ajokli, deception itself.
I am a warrior of ages, Anasurimbor. . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury. -Cet'ingira

H

  • *
  • The Zero-Mod
  • Old Name
  • *****
  • The Honourable H
  • Posts: 2813
  • The Original No-God Apologist
    • View Profile
    • The Original No-God Apologist
« Reply #34 on: August 06, 2020, 04:56:40 pm »
This could also be seen as another example of the intersection or mediation of the Universal with/through the Particular (and the reverse as well).  Or, the Eternal and Temporal.  Ajokli is the Universal of deception, the behavior is the Particular instance of it.  Yet, the Particular fuels the Universal as well, feeds it.

This sort of question about how the Eternal could or would interact with the Temporal/Finite really runs though TAE, I think.
I am a warrior of ages, Anasurimbor. . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury. -Cet'ingira

TaoHorror

  • *
  • Old Name
  • *****
  • Posts: 1111
  • Blueberry PsĂ»khe Sorcerer
    • View Profile
« Reply #35 on: August 06, 2020, 07:06:23 pm »
This could also be seen as another example of the intersection or mediation of the Universal with/through the Particular (and the reverse as well).  Or, the Eternal and Temporal.  Ajokli is the Universal of deception, the behavior is the Particular instance of it.  Yet, the Particular fuels the Universal as well, feeds it.

This sort of question about how the Eternal could or would interact with the Temporal/Finite really runs though TAE, I think.

So why 100? Could be arbitrary, have to stop somewhere coming up with universals/foundations/First Principles, just a round number of the 100 perceived most important. Eerily reminiscent of the base human psychological states as defined by the Dunyain ( Fear Base -2 ) - looks like the nonmen made gods out of them.
May your death be soon, slow and painful

H

  • *
  • The Zero-Mod
  • Old Name
  • *****
  • The Honourable H
  • Posts: 2813
  • The Original No-God Apologist
    • View Profile
    • The Original No-God Apologist
« Reply #36 on: August 06, 2020, 07:55:26 pm »
So why 100? Could be arbitrary, have to stop somewhere coming up with universals/foundations/First Principles, just a round number of the 100 perceived most important. Eerily reminiscent of the base human psychological states as defined by the Dunyain ( Fear Base -2 ) - looks like the nonmen made gods out of them.

Indeed, I mean, why any number?  Aesthetics?  Hard to say.  Really any number would be arbitrary, because if the "true" Universal is Infinite, there is no end to enumerating it.  So any number layered on top of that is completely arbitrary, nothing could approximate actual infinity, even infinity really.
I am a warrior of ages, Anasurimbor. . . ages. I have dipped my nimil in a thousand hearts. I have ridden both against and for the No-God in the great wars that authored this wilderness. I have scaled the ramparts of great Golgotterath, watched the hearts of High Kings break for fury. -Cet'ingira